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Pilots For 9/11 Truth Forum _ United 93 _ A problem I have with Flight 93

Posted by: IVXX Oct 24 2006, 07:47 AM

OK we've all seen hundreds of pictures of the crash site. The nice little "cartoon cut-out" in the ground. Here's a list of a few problems I have.........

- First and foremost, the grass around the imapct isn't burnt. It would seem no fire touched it at all.

- You have the body of the plane and the wings in the "cartoon cut-out" but no tail section mark.

- Also where is the "cartoon cut-out" for the engines that should be about midway from body to wing tip along the wings.

- The official lie tells us that due to the force of imapct with the gorund at almost 500 miles an houir most of the debris and remains are buried 50 ft or better into the ground. At first I thought, "OK I can buy that" but then one small problem. As they're moving earth to dig up debris and remains one of the first things they recover is an engine. What?? The engines are the heaviest thing on these planes and by official lie logic should have been buried deeper into the earth than anything upon impact.

Anyway I know I'm not the only one to think of these things. They definitely make you go "Hmmmmmmm" and I can't believe that anyone who buys the official lie doesn't ask these same questions. I just figured I would share incase anyone here missed one of these details.

cheers.gif

Posted by: johndoeX Oct 24 2006, 07:51 AM

http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=75&view=findpost&p=3569600

Posted by: IVXX Oct 24 2006, 08:00 AM

I've seen that before and was going to ask if you had it but knew you had to. Yet another fact I guess we're just suppose to roll over and pretend doesn't exist.

Posted by: Lights Oct 26 2006, 07:31 PM

Yep I do believe the government actually wants us to roll over and play oblivious.
Dunno gang, but the more I see the less I believe the official story.

Posted by: IVXX Oct 28 2006, 05:04 AM

I don't know what's worse. The crap the gov't thinks will swallow or the amout of people who are.

Posted by: TPE331-10 Oct 28 2006, 12:13 PM

QUOTE (IVXX @ Oct 28 2006, 09:04 AM)
I don't know what's worse. The crap the gov't thinks will swallow or the amout of people who are.

the sheeple I am afraid.

Posted by: IVXX Oct 30 2006, 12:38 AM

QUOTE (TPE331-10 @ Oct 28 2006, 04:13 PM)
QUOTE (IVXX @ Oct 28 2006, 09:04 AM)
I don't know what's worse. The crap the gov't thinks will swallow or the amout of people who are.

the sheeple I am afraid.

I would have to agree.

Posted by: Lights Oct 30 2006, 03:48 PM

Me, too. It is like the American people are sleepwalking and anyone who tries to wake them from this state is exposed to vituperation and possible government interference!

Posted by: IVXX Nov 1 2006, 12:32 PM

QUOTE (Lights @ Oct 30 2006, 07:48 PM)
Me, too. It is like the American people are sleepwalking and anyone who tries to wake them from this state is exposed to vituperation and possible government interference!

It seems a popular reply is "How is it affecting my life??" doh1.gif

Posted by: NJcpaTOM Nov 1 2006, 03:09 PM

QUOTE (IVXX @ Oct 28 2006, 09:04 AM)
I don't know what's worse. The crap the gov't thinks will swallow or the amout of people who are.


My sister belives United 93 crashed. She and her daughter went to a funeral of a friend of theirs who was on that Flight. Therefore it crashed - period

I printed out about 3/4 inches of documents from various websites, threw in 2 videos and a book and gave them to her. Haven't seen her since.

The most amazing thing to me is that there are so many people who know the truth and just let it continue to go on. Isn't that wierd ?

Planning to build memorials to passengers in a field for a plane that never crashed there?
What are they thinking?

I believe that United 93 landed safely in an airport as originally reported in the newspaper. Then the newspaper claims that there was an error in the story and removed it from the internet.

I believe the Mayor who said that United 93 landed in an airport and the Pa county coronor who stated that he had stopped being a Coronor 20 minuets after he arrived at the scene because there were no bodies nor wreckage.

I believe that all of the above were retracted because they were made an offer that they couldn't refuse.

I can't see how the President can keep a straight face when he lays a wreath at the wrong spot. He sure has the people fooled doesn't he.

pilotfly.gif

Posted by: IVXX Nov 2 2006, 04:13 PM

QUOTE (NJcpaTOM @ Nov 1 2006, 07:09 PM)
My sister belives United 93 crashed. She and her daughter went to a funeral of a friend of theirs who was on that Flight. Therefore it crashed - period

That's a tough one though. I can understand some people not wanting to believe it cause they lost someone. In their mind the official story is closure. I'm not saying it's right but I can understand not wanting to continue the hurt. I lost a family friend in NY who worked for NYPA and my cousin who also worked for the PA was lucky enough to get out.

Posted by: Lights Nov 4 2006, 12:07 PM

Unfortunately, most of the people in this country are making like ostriches when it comes to 9/11 truth. They would rather hypnotise their minds with "reality" crap like "Survivor" and ignore the biggest reality there is" that 9/11 was probably an inside job and even if it wasn't Bush is using it to kill off thousands of American young people in Iraq and to set up a dictatorship here in America!

Posted by: HaylonH Feb 16 2007, 12:10 PM

I don't care if that plane had've been going 1000mph, there's no way it could completely bury itself into the ground. Unless it hit quicksand....did anyone see any quicksand?

Posted by: amazed! Feb 19 2007, 05:57 PM

NJcpa

You got that right! salute.gif

Posted by: biggahthebettah Apr 4 2007, 07:52 PM

I was just reading up on Flight 93. It struck me anew that the families of the victims were not allowed to record in any manner anything they heard on the tapes, and no reporters were allowed into the hearing. Apparently, according to the site I was on, the last 7 minutes were full of screaming in both English and Arabic. I just had an epiphany. I think that the powers that be do not want anybody recording off of the tape, b/c they are afraid that the tapes could be taken to a translator and we could hear what the highjackers were really saying. It struck me after reading the above, and after reading that the highjackers were overheard by the control tower saying that they were returning to the airport, that if there were human highjackers aboard, that control of the plane might have been taken out of their hands via remote and that in the last few minutes they realized it...and/or they too might have heard what happened with the WTC towers and realized what was about to happen to them. It's always been my feeling that if the planes WERE piloted by humans, that the highjackers didn't know it was a suicide mission. Any thoughts?

http://www.thememoryhole.org/911/ap-93tape.htm

Posted by: painter Apr 5 2007, 03:50 AM

QUOTE (biggahthebettah @ Apr 4 2007, 03:52 PM)
I was just reading up on Flight 93. It struck me anew that the families of the victims were not allowed to record in any manner anything they heard on the tapes, and no reporters were allowed into the hearing. Apparently, according to the site I was on, the last 7 minutes were full of screaming in both English and Arabic. I just had an epiphany. I think that the powers that be do not want anybody recording off of the tape, b/c they are afraid that the tapes could be taken to a translator and we could hear what the highjackers were really saying. It struck me after reading the above, and after reading that the highjackers were overheard by the control tower saying that they were returning to the airport, that if there were human highjackers aboard, that control of the plane might have been taken out of their hands via remote and that in the last few minutes they realized it...and/or they too might have heard what happened with the WTC towers and realized what was about to happen to them. It's always been my feeling that if the planes WERE piloted by humans, that the highjackers didn't know it was a suicide mission. Any thoughts?

http://www.thememoryhole.org/911/ap-93tape.htm

Could be. dunno.gif Could be there were no people on the planes that crashed at all. Could be that at least some of the planes never crashed -- or, rather, that whatever did crash wasn't the planes we were told about. The disturbing thing is the publicly available evidence is inconclusive.

Posted by: mycall Apr 5 2007, 09:05 AM

What still bugs me is "why?"

Why land the plane safely by remote control and then have to kill all the passengers, while you can just crash it anywhere and have the same result with no risk of being caught?


I think that flight 93 has been shot down, probably because things weren't going as scheduled.

Maybe the remote control system didn't work as expected, maybe the hijackers managed to turn it off and thus became uncontrolable, maybe ...

Posted by: biggahthebettah Apr 5 2007, 01:46 PM

QUOTE (mycall @ Apr 5 2007, 08:05 AM)
What still bugs me is "why?"

Why land the plane safely by remote control and then have to kill all the passengers, while you can just crash it anywhere and have the same result with no risk of being caught?


I think that flight 93 has been shot down, probably because things weren't going as scheduled.

Maybe the remote control system didn't work as expected, maybe the hijackers managed to turn it off and thus became uncontrolable, maybe ...

That fits in with what I'm saying. maybe they too heard that the towers and the pentagon had been hit, and realized that they were duped into a suicide mission and tried to override the controls and the gov't was afraid maybe they'd be able to use airphones to contact the outside world and tell all. Hence the shootdown. Arabs screaming doesn't fit in otherwise. maybe a little stern warning or yelling, but 7 minutes of screaming? no.

Posted by: amazed! Apr 7 2007, 10:00 PM

How many aircraft participated in Vigilant Guardian that day? How many and of what types?

Posted by: hardloperhans Apr 8 2007, 05:26 PM

I have a theory of my own about Flight 93.

Everybody loves heroes. Especially when they are ordinary people, like your relatives or neighbors.
The whole drama of 9/11 became more convincing because of all those small tragedies.
The firemen in the WTC, doing their job and sacrificing their lives.
The phonecalls of the passengers.
The phonecall of Todd Beamer with the operator Lisa Jefferson.
The desperate struggle of the passengers of Flight 93 to stop the plane from reaching the White House. Another sacrifice.

I believe the phonecalls were staged, they were part of the plan.
The whole myth of Flight 93 is based on the phonecalls. There were no survivors, no witnesses in the plane. Even the tape could be faked or doctored.
It's the perfect story for a Hollywood-movie.
The bad guys are very bad and wearing red bandana's laugh.gif
The good guys are very good. They call their loved ones, bring the ultimate sacrifice and save the nation.

I have no theory about what actually happened.

Posted by: georgie101 Apr 9 2007, 11:34 AM

hardloperhans, my gut feeling is exactly the same about flight 93. And the film that was brought out, Flight 93, was made purley to brainwash people.

Posted by: Bolko Apr 23 2007, 06:16 AM

So why crashes flight UA 93 although it was remote controlled?

Posted by: brayman Jun 3 2007, 09:41 PM

QUOTE (HaylonH @ Feb 16 2007, 11:10 AM)
I don't care if that plane had've been going 1000mph, there's no way it could completely bury itself into the ground. Unless it hit quicksand....did anyone see any quicksand?

agree completely

Posted by: barbeja Jul 2 2007, 11:32 PM

[QUOTE=NJcpaTOM,Nov 1 2006, 02:09 PM]My sister belives United 93 crashed. She and her daughter went to a funeral of a friend of theirs who was on that Flight.

/QUOTE]
I too went to a memorial service for a friend that had both parents on this flight. It was very sad, and my heart and soul cried for this person and family--still does.

While I've since been astounded at the number of inconsistencies with the official stories of that day, I will never approach my friend and say "What do you think?" It's way too insensitive to even think of such a thing. Now, if that person ever said, "What do you think..." That's another story entirely.

One thing that struck me very odd is that there was a memorial placed outside of our workplace. About a year ago I notice that the plaque had been removed. No explanation, no rumors, no ackowlegement by the powers that be, nothing. No attempt at replacing it if it was theft or vandalism (which I can't fathom). Very peculiar and distressing...or fitting, I'm not sure.

Posted by: Cary Jul 3 2007, 10:03 AM

Welcome to the forum barbeja.

I've read reports of people going to funerals for flight 93 passengers. Were there any bodies at this service? Or was it just a memorial service? Not trying to be insensitive, it's just that the county coroner who arrived at the scene found NO BODIES there. He's later quoted as saying that he didn't find one drop of blood at the site.

Posted by: barbeja Jul 3 2007, 07:31 PM

Thanks for the welcome. You all are doing good work.

It was a memorial service.

Posted by: barbeja Jul 3 2007, 07:35 PM

Just rereading my post, I meant to say that my friend was also a coworker and still worked there when the memorial plaque to the parents went missing.

Posted by: hturt Jul 3 2007, 09:27 PM

Flight 93 to me is more of a "red herring" because the harder evidence is in WTC and the Pentagon. That said, maybe Flight 93 was a back up plan. I "floater" plane incase the other 3 didn't hit their targets; it was the last to crash. I personally lean to the "Hero" theory someone mentioned, but still could fit into both theories. I think they took their queue from "Wag the Dog"http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0120885/. Can't have a war without a hero.

Posted by: amazed! Jul 5 2007, 11:00 PM

hturt

93 was icing on the cake, as it were. It looked good for the media and the masses.

In fact, they encouraged many to believe it had been shot down. They did that through dissemination of false information, and I was one that took it, hook, line and sinker. I believed it for years, but I can see now that it was just the propaganda machine working full time.

There was no Boeing there.

Posted by: barbeja Jul 10 2007, 09:57 PM

Just to clear things up with my above post where I mentioned a "missing" memorial plaque, please disregard this. It was removed to be cleaned and placed in a very lovely new base. God rest their souls wherever they may be.

Posted by: Atjoer Sep 1 2007, 03:34 PM

There was absolutely something not normal with flight 93 and I have strong feelings that the plane landed safe somewhere, maybe Chicago, I will tell my story....

On September 10th 2001 me and my wife moved to New Jersey, after unpacking our moving truck I met my neighbour and we started talking, she told me she was a flight attendant for United Airlines and I was always wondering how those people organize their lives with all that flying so we started talking about that a bit more, apparently she only flew domestic so she was home several times a week which would make a "normal" life possible, I asked her when her next flight was and she said tomorrow morning, flight 93 from Newark to San Francisco, I wished her a safe trip and went on returning our rented moving truck.
Well, next morning the War Game started and it took me about two days before I remembered the details about the talk I had with my neighbour and I told my wife that we probably wouldn't see her back because she was on that flight.
A week later I see her coming home and I asked her what happened and without any emotion she told me that she was put on another flight and got stuck in Chicago because all flights were down and it was clear that she didn't wanted to talk about it.

I don't know, never thought anything weird of it but since two days I'm trying to find the real truth about what happened on 9/11 after seeing a documentary on History where I feld that the real facts didn't pop up and after reading a truckload of stuff it might be interesting enough to share it with you guys.

Posted by: Oceans Flow Sep 1 2007, 04:21 PM

Welcome to the forum, Atjoer. I knew that the bogus History Channel piece would actually cause lots of people to have questions they never had before. wink.gif

Your story is most interesting. Thanks for sharing.

You have landed on a great forum. As someone who is new to this, you will find huge amounts of information. The subject of 9/11 is complex and massive and can be daunting. Please check out the Library where you can learn most of the essentials at your own pace and according to what is most interesting to you.

Waking up to the truth can be quite emotionally difficult as well, and that is part of the purpose of this message board. Mutual support in times of dark and frightening thoughts is essential.

Again, welcome. salute.gif

Posted by: Cary Sep 1 2007, 05:02 PM

Welcome to the forum Atjoer. Interesting story.

Posted by: amazed! Sep 1 2007, 10:17 PM

atjoer

Yes, a fascinating story, and welcome.

Did you ever see the woman again? Rumor has it that anybody associated with those flights is very reluctant to talk.

Posted by: Atjoer Sep 2 2007, 01:35 AM

QUOTE (amazed! @ Sep 1 2007, 07:17 PM)
atjoer

Yes, a fascinating story, and welcome.

Did you ever see the woman again? Rumor has it that anybody associated with those flights is very reluctant to talk.

I did see her on a regular basis after that for about a year until I bought a house in town and moved out of the apartment complex but there was no way to steer any conversation into her scheduled flight on 9/11 and talk about that, that topic was closed.
Another interesting point may be for some members (not me because I think differently about the involvement of the Muslim community in these War Games) that she lived in Saoudi Arabia for about five years with her now ex husband (native American who was put to work there, don't know exactly what kind of work) and had some Arabic sticker on the bumper of her car that got scratched up badly weeks after 9/11 and it really, really upset her.

Again , I don't know, I'm new to the scene, a couple of days ago I saw some weird bets on the stock market in Europe to go down dramatically before sep 21st and it just rememberred me of the days before 9/11/2001 when I saw a similar weird behavior with puts on some American airline companies to go down also so I started looking around on the Internet to see if more people feld uncomfortable with the situation going on right now and it led me to a bunch of sites that shared the same feelings I had since 9/11 but I never talked about it because it was just too weird to even think about it in a way it could be an inside job.
For all those years I just followed the good American citizens (I was a recent imigrant from the Netherlands before 9/11 so I wasn't supposed to have any opinion with domestic problems) with their opinions and went with the flow even when I had serious suspicion about what I saw on TV that day.
Hmmm.., this might be becoming more for an "Introduce Yourself" topic but I need to get this of my chest now since I'm holding this for almost six years and I cannot believe how dumb I acted for all those years even after I literally saw the smoke from the War Games from my house and even when I saw it I knew that it smelled worse than a skunk just drivin over by a fine domestic automobile.
When I saw the live broadcast of the impact I already was sispicious (that's just my nature according to my wife) about the huge flames at the moment of the impact, planes are powered by diesel (kerosine) and diesel is a very stable fuel almost impossible to ignite like gasoline without heating it up dramatically and the Hollywood like explosion looked odd to me but since the "attack" was so cruel and everybody was in tears I didn't even realized that for a while, another raising of the eyebrowe on that day was the absolutely perfect collapse of the towers, demolation companies couldn't do a better job and if that wasn't enough we had some more, a similar perfect collapse of a buidling that wasn't even hit by any plane was just the icing on the cake America got that day.
As a Flight Simulator rookie from the early 90's I know how difficult it is to hit a spot exactly like that in a tower with a big commercial plane and I just had a hard time believing that an experienced pilot would do the job even with a gun (or box cutter) pointed to his head but as I said earlier, the whole day was just a mess with lots of emotions and I just forgot about it the days after that.
The days after the "event" were just chaotic and I didn't even noticed the weird "survival" of my neighbour until recently when I noticed some possible build up for another big event like six years ago with 9/11 and I looked for answers on the Internet.
Now I know that I'm not the only one with un-answered questions about 9/11 and I also strongly believe that flight 93 made it to a safe landing somewhere because my neighbour who was scheduled on that flight walked in her home safely after a week but didn't wanted to talk about it at all.

Anyhow, this stinks and even after six years we have to find the truth because I feel that 9/11 was just a test and bigger "games" are coming soon.

Posted by: Obwon Jun 27 2011, 09:00 AM

QUOTE (Atjoer @ Sep 1 2007, 02:34 PM) *
There was absolutely something not normal with flight 93 and I have strong feelings that the plane landed safe somewhere, maybe Chicago, I will tell my story....

On September 10th 2001 me and my wife moved to New Jersey, after unpacking our moving truck I met my neighbour and we started talking, she told me she was a flight attendant for United Airlines and I was always wondering how those people organize their lives with all that flying so we started talking about that a bit more, apparently she only flew domestic so she was home several times a week which would make a "normal" life possible, I asked her when her next flight was and she said tomorrow morning, flight 93 from Newark to San Francisco, I wished her a safe trip and went on returning our rented moving truck.
Well, next morning the War Game started and it took me about two days before I remembered the details about the talk I had with my neighbour and I told my wife that we probably wouldn't see her back because she was on that flight.
A week later I see her coming home and I asked her what happened and without any emotion she told me that she was put on another flight and got stuck in Chicago because all flights were down and it was clear that she didn't wanted to talk about it.

I don't know, never thought anything weird of it but since two days I'm trying to find the real truth about what happened on 9/11 after seeing a documentary on History where I feld that the real facts didn't pop up and after reading a truckload of stuff it might be interesting enough to share it with you guys.


What I've read is that flight 93 didn't exist until sometime in early Sept. it's
on one of the threads here, maybe: "Something strange about flight 93".
In any event, two of the skyjackers supposedly purchased their tickets in
August, and so, they would have reserved seats on flight 91.
I have no idea what this might mean to you, you might find something
useful in it. Flight 91 was supposedly canceled because of a cracked
windshield and some of the passengers transferred to flight 93.

Yet, when the "no fly" order came down, flight 91 was sitting at the
head of the runway waiting for clearance to take off. Go figure.

Anyway, my working theory is that flight 93 contained the real passengers
from those other supposed flights, somehow collected and flown to Newark,
some sort of "magic trick" was played. But, it was to assure higher
ups, who would have had to approve the 9-11 plan, that no passengers
had be harmed. At the towers, the "strikes", would have all but assured
that most people there would be able to evacuate. "Northwoods" was to
have no real casualties.

So, 93 was flown to Cleveland Hopkins where the passengers were deplaned
and held at the NASA Center, so that the "big boys" could confirm that they
were safe, and that things were going according to the plans that had been
approved by them. Then the perps working inside the plan, detonated
charges that blocked the stairwells, trapping thousands inside who couldn't
get out. There were "unavoidable deaths" and so that's when the plans
had to be changed.

The people who had landed on flght 93 at Cleveland, could not now be
allowed to survive. So they were taken away from there somehow and
silenced. The story of the Shanksville crash was just yet another creation.

I still haven't sorted out how such a thing could be worked out. So far it's
just a collection of logical/reported pieces, that I haven't been able to line up.
So it's just a jumble, but maybe someone who reads it, might find a piece
or two they can use.

Oh yes, while I'm at it, here's some more interesting stuff:

Over the last few year I've been noticing a discrepancy
between the times of the north and south tower hits, of
about three or four minutes. I noticed no one had thought
much of it, nor did anyone else. That is, except to note
that the discrepancy existed and is even reflected
and memorialized in the official 9-11 reports.

Over the last few weeks I've been watching the videos on
youtube and those reposted here. I came across those
videos that show the nose of the aircraft, emerging from
the north face of the south tower intact.

Two of them, apparently filmed from the west and
broadcast as "live" on tv, showed this feature. The
writer noted that when the film (that's all they could
be is "film") was broadcast, both stations made what
appeared to be an effort to "cover the error", by going
to a black screen for about 15 frames.

Well, this morning while in that half sleep state before
waking, the videos started playing in my head. There
were two more vids that appeared to be taken from the
east, that showed the same thing, the nose of the
aircraft emerging from the north face of the south tower.

Well, by dumb luck, the last threads I had read yesterday
had to do with people debunking the "NPT" by saying that
all of these videos couldn't be false, to which the reply was
"the nose knows". Obviously a sly reference to the
"nose out" videos (okay, that's me, simplifying it).

Much of the debate centered around "live" or not live. The
posters seemed to think that the reason that the videos were
so badly done, for a project of such vital importance, is that
there was so little time to do it. In fact, the point was made
that the 3 to 6 second delay, would hardly be enough to
make and insert fake content.

That's when I thought "Gee, how much time was there?".
The NPT detractors were saying that with only a three to six
second delay, there wasn't much time to both make the
videos and then insert them into the live program stream.
That's when it hit me, there had to be more time, and
perhaps that accounts for the difference in times that
appear in the 9-11 reports and elsewhere.

If so, then in reality there were some 3 to 4 minutes
available to prepare the vids and insert them. And this
difference accounts for those impact time discrepancies.

The planes were disappearing behind a layer mask, which
accounts for them going so smoothly into the buildings.
Because there just wasn't time to do anything else and
still meet the deadline. Especially since more than one
vantage point was needed, meaning that more than one
video had to be produced in that same time slice.

Thus rushed, they didn't notice that the layer mask
had moved allowing the nose of the craft to appear to
have emerged from the building intact. So, because
they were so pressed for time, they had to release these
gosh-awful videos as they were.

To cover up that these videos were not shown in "real time",
the actual time of the event had to be moved to match the
release time. Only in this way, could it be reasonably claimed
that the videos were being shown "live".

---
Well that's my take.

Obwon










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