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Global Warming: A Convenient Lie, by Andrew Marshall.

Timothy Osman
post Apr 14 2007, 09:12 AM
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I just read this interesting article about Ian Pilmers view on the greenhouse effect. Somehow I ended up finding an Aussie forum called Infowars, It looks pretty good. I was starting to think we were all sheep after Billzilla and the like.

http://www.news.com.au/adelaidenow/story/0...564-911,00.html

http://www.infowars.com.au/forum/index.php
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bill
post Apr 14 2007, 10:14 AM
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What an incredible peice of propaganda

about 45 seconds of Pilmer 'humans aren't responsible for climate change'

and 6 minutes of smokestack after smokestack after belching smoketack


hilarious
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Timothy Osman
post Apr 14 2007, 10:27 AM
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QUOTE (bill @ Apr 14 2007, 02:14 PM)
What an incredible peice of propaganda

about 45 seconds of Pilmer 'humans aren't responsible for climate change'

and 6 minutes of smokestack after smokestack after belching smoketack


hilarious

Yeah, you gotta love the Australian media. laugh.gif
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painter
post Apr 14 2007, 04:03 PM
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QUOTE (bill @ Apr 11 2007, 10:25 AM)
Well said Cary !


Painter I am somewhat surprised

Is is better to drink terrist "Kool aid" or Global Warming "Kool aid"

you're still dead

More laws controlling more and more of your life is freedom ?

a tax on your wood burner cause it creates CO2 is freedom and decentralization of power ?

Charging a man 'road tax' for burning diesel from fast food grease is freedom and decentraliztion ?

A global beauracracy that will control how warm you keep your living room is decentralization ?


come on, man, don't drink  Kool aid of any flavor

believing in a lie can never be health

the ends DON' T justify the means


etc etc etc

Fine. We're going to have to learn to think strategically, not just emotionally. I think I understand where you are coming from BUT the question I'll pose to you is what is your strategy. What is your plan?

You have to give a clear analysis of the underlying structures of power as they are currently being used to literally fuel our very complex global civilization. How are you going to change those structures of power fundamentaly?

My position is your dichotomy [Is is better to drink terrist "Kool aid" or Global Warming "Kool aid"] is false. The question is, what are we going to do to fundamentally restructure global society?

My answer is that this can not be done overnight -- although it can occur relatively quickly from a historical perspective. It has to proceed in stages. What is needed is a movement away from centralization toward decentralization. So, I ask the question, which direction does the Kool Aid of any program lead? I base my decision on that. I also know that the elites will use whatever they can to further entrench and increase the reach of their hegemony. That is where we come into the picture. Our job is to not let them. Anything that works against that hegemony is a good thing, IMO, whether it is ultimately 'true' in the full sense of the word or not.

So, what I'm trying to say is, this fundamental change isn't going to occur in one fell swoop. It can't because the underlying structures to make such a thing possible have not yet been created. What do we think would happen, for example, if via some miracle or other the global monetary system as it is now shaped were to suddenly disappear? Wealth and power have a reciprocal relationship. When you redefine what 'wealth' is, you also redefine 'power'. Right now wealth creation and power is a system that is closely held and guarded by a very small minority on this planet. You and I may not like it but it is a fact. The bananas I had for my breakfast got to me, and were affordable to me, in large measure because of it. I didn't grow them, harvest them and eat them. I exchanged some paper for them through a system. I understand that that system works more for my advantage than the person who DID grow them and harvest them -- and this is a very fundamental problem. How can this system be changed? The situation in the Middle East regarding oil and opium is simply a more militerized version of the banana/paper exchange. Iraq, Iran, don't want to exchange their oil for my paper so our military is their to make sure they do, whether they want to or not. And it was precisely this kind of 'thinking' that led to 9/11.

We are all part of the problem. All of us. We have to understand this problem. We have to understand our role in it and our responsibility for changing it. And we need a plan, a strategy, for global economic change.

In my view, GW as a global political issue could serve the purpose of gradually redefining the global market place more equitably -- for one thing because it could decentralize energy production -- which is equivalent to decentralizing wealth creation and power. That is why I am willing to entertain it as a possible, necessary step. That doesn't mean I'm unaware of the potential risks -- but there are going to e risks no matter what strategy we choose.

Offer me a workable, implantable, policy alternative that can more rapidly shift the balance of power away from the fascist elite and I'll be all for it -- but I haven't seen any such policy proposal emanating from anyone who has a chance in hell of getting it accepted.

You want to change things, you have to have a strategic plan.

What is yours?
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André
post Apr 14 2007, 05:52 PM
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QUOTE
You want to change things, you have to have a strategic plan.
What is yours?


Well I can't answer for Bill but I do not see any need for a strategic plan, we are a diverse group and the only thing holding us together is the quest for the truth and that in itself is a struggle since we do not agree on everything.

911 is just the tip of the iceberg, the learning process goes on. For most of us here it's too late and we can't go back, we do not wish to go back, always struggling to make sense of it all, we follow the evidence where it leads us, if we have to reevaluate our beliefs, then so be it...

Politicians might need to have strategies, make compromises (I understand that), but we do not, our only strategies should be finding better ways to exposing the lies, waking up people, the rest will take care of itself once there are enough of us.

As far All Gore is concerned, he has too many strikes against him, and the global warming (caused by co2) hoax is the worst of them.

My 2 cents.
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MichaelMR
post Apr 14 2007, 07:21 PM
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QUOTE
You want to change things, you have to have a strategic plan.

What is yours?


We can't get down at the fundamental level for change as voting citizens, Painter. There are things going on in our government that even the highest officials have no control over, let alone us. Most of the great presidents we’ve had have been assassinated or oppressed in their quests for change. As great and honorable men as Ron Paul and Dennis Kucinich are, they won’t EVER see office until people start understanding the issues at hand. Period.

I keep hearing people say we need the world to change, world peace, world this and that. It’s a load of bullshit. PEOPLE need to change. That is all that is there to it. Arrogant humans will never address the fact that it is THEM who need to change. They always carefully mention the “world.” Not peace among people or the need for people to change the way they think.

As far as global warming, an Edmund Burke quote comes to mind:

“No passion so effectually robs the mind of all its powers of acting and reasoning as fear.”

This is what the global warming farce is. WIDE SPREAD FEAR AND PROPAGANDA. We need to stop thinking about changing the government and fundamentals behind America. What we need to do is change people’s perception to the truth of what these situations are. The global warming issue is CLEARLY a lie and hoax. It’s generating such an alarming amount of worry in the citizens that it’s been turned into a political issue and in turn, is now a profiteering business. If we change the way people think and open their eyes to alternatives so they can fully comprehend WHY change is necessary then we accomplish a strategic stand point. We won’t have support if people don’t have a clue and only hear the side of official word.

Look at what 9/11 truth is doing and why it has become such a massive movement. It is opening the eyes of millions through truth and is getting down to the very core of the fundamental thought that people once had. Millions are now awake by speaking out and simply not supporting these outrageous lies.

There is nothing that can “rapidly shift the balance of power away from the fascist elite.” All that is is optimism, at best. Nothing happens in a blink of an eye and we sure as hell can’t impact this issue, which is now on a global scale, through that way.

If you support Al Gore’s stance on global warming, you support the fascist elite. Period. If you try waking people up similar to how you’ve down with 9/11 truth, you’ve already done an enormous amount. There is no radical way for change. All we can do is support and expose the truth. Once we’ve started spreading the truth on a massive scale, we’ll have support on a massive scale. I like the thought of the educated people of earth vs. the fascist elite, don’t you? Once the PEOPLE of the world are awake, you won’t have sheep to scare and flock together on ignorant theories. That alone, in my opinion, is the ultimate strategy. It has worked wonders for 9/11 truth. I’ll go by that example.

Up to you guys to do what you want. I know what I’m doing.
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painter
post Apr 14 2007, 08:28 PM
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QUOTE (MichaelMR @ Apr 14 2007, 03:21 PM)
<s>
If you support Al Gore’s stance on global warming, you support the fascist elite. Period.
<s>

Well, that is a statement of your opinion, painted with a very broad brush. You need to back this up with something more than your say so before I'll accept it without reservation.

Al Gore is a liberal Democrat. I understand what liberals are and what function they play in the system. From the point of view of radical politics -- that is, those who want revolutionary change -- a "liberal" serves the function of mitigating the contradictions that make revolution inevitable. From a class analysis POV, revolution can only occur when the contradictions between the elite and the masses becomes so acute that revolutionary change is demanded. Liberals play the role of lessening those contradictions -- advocating for changes in social policy such as fare wage, limited work hours, better working conditions, etc. They use the force of law and the state to institute policy which transfers some power and wealth from the 'haves' to the 'have nots'. There is not one person from this country on this board who hasn't benefitted materially and in terms of overall social conditions from liberal policies of the past 100 years. Simultaneously, I can also say that there isn't one person on this board who hasn't been negatively impacted by liberal policy in so much as it has allowed the global elite to retain and extend their hegemony.

Part of what has happened since 9/11 (and before) can be understood as an attempt to permanently overthrow the gains working class people made in this country due to liberal policies instituted from the FDR era onward. Many of the laments that have arisen regarding the loss of America has to do with the loss of the America that FDR Liberalism created and set in motion as policy. The attempted coup d'état against FDR shows to what extent the fascist elite were willing to go in those times to prevent the liberal policies he would undertake to end the depression of the 1930s. Ever since the end of WW II, fascists within this country have been working to piggy back their way into the offices of power using domestic covert operations, Conservatism, Christian fundamentalism and the Republican party. Yes, many Democrats are in their pockets as well, but not all of them. The selection of W in the 2000 election was the final culmination of years of planning -- and which allowed them to pull off 9/11 and get away with it, thus justifying the Patriot Act and the WoT.

Al Gore is a liberal in the FDR sense of the word. He would institute polices that would redirect our national priorities toward peaceful prosperity when ever and where ever possible. That is a loss for the fascist elite, not a gain. A Gore presidency would set the stage for the kinds of deep infrastructural changes we need to become less dependant upon the global fascist elite and their global banking / energy / military hegemony. Think of where we would be today without the internet where we can share information horizontally for the most part absent any government or corporate control. Gore helped shape the internet through his legislation and we all owe him considerable gratitude for that. Changing the national and international focus to ecological issues would be the next best step to a genuine revolution, IMO -- provided it continued to reverse the trends established since 9/11.

Ultimately, for a genuine revolution, we need a new form of wealth creation -- and I believe that is Gore's actual, unstated, intention.
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MichaelMR
post Apr 14 2007, 10:30 PM
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I wasn't talking about Al Gore. I was talking about his stance on global warming. He is the front runner of the whole farce and represents the official lie. That is why I said if you support his stance on global warming, you support either consciously or unconsciously, the agenda of the fascist elite. Republicans, democrats and everything in between including corporate giants and his CFR buddies all support him. Most of the people who are struggling to speak out against this are independent scholars who are trying to get the word out. The majority of them are too scared to come out because of their jobs and PR, some even get death threats.

I can’t even begin to fathom why anyone would honestly support any of this. We aren’t even a 1/2 of a percent of the CO2 emissions. The total human greenhouse gas contributions add up to about 0.28% of the greenhouse effect. This is a sad and pathetic even, insult to the intelligence of the people who inhabit this earth.

I’m sorry but, in my honest opinion, to support Gore is to support this farce. It’s similar as if Ron Paul were to come out and say another investigation into 9/11 is bullshit, yet still have many other good qualities to him. It is also VERY clear that Al Gore doesn’t plan on becoming president, so regardless of those good qualities, he still wouldn’t influence change on the level you’re talking about. Nor would I want him to be if he still supported this radical belief. I don’t believe in pyrrhic victories.
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lunk
post Apr 15 2007, 01:18 AM
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It looks to me like an ice age begins 2022, if this is true.


http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2006/10may_longrange.htm


The weakened heliosphere will allow more cosmic rays through to the lower atmosphere of Earth creating more overcast skies everywhere, thus cooling its' surface.

Cool?
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Timothy Osman
post Apr 15 2007, 04:10 AM
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Uh oh, looks like a case of following the money, because Al and Bill look like they're going to make a killing on Carbon trading.

QUOTE
Look behind—if you dare—Al Gore and his science hoax, and you find the very same London-centered oligarchical financial crew that drove the 2003-2006 oil and commodity price increase, amidst the bubbles and hyperinflation that characterize the breakdown-phase of the financial system. The centerpiece of the U.S. emerging market for carbon emissions trading, is the Chicago Climate Exchange (CCX), created in 2003 as a "voluntary," or pilot agency, part of a London-based network positioned to reproduce the oil bubble on a scale orders of magnitude greater and more dangerous, while at the same time, destroying what's left of the physical economy.

The idea is that if governments cap CO2 emissions, then the "market" will take off for the buying and selling of emissions "allowances." This is the whole point of the "cap-and-trade" plan for CO2. If it sounds crazy, it is. But Gore is just one of the most visible parts of the elaborate (and bi-partisan) schemes that have been set in motion under cover of climate change. Gore's personal financial involvement is blatant, especially through Goldman Sachs—a large shareholder of CCX, and in 2004, the creator of Gore's very own London-based hedge fund, Generation Investment Management.


http://www.larouchepub.com/other/2007/3413...on_swindle.html



QUOTE
One hopes that science will prevail. It is the only way people can prevent the climate alarmists, backed by the media and the state, from carrying out their plan to "save the planet." If not stopped, they will eventually establish global governance; dismantle modern technology; cripple industry; impose carbon rationing with radical reductions in the average American’s standard of living and quality of life; and inflict untold misery, suffering, and death for hundreds of millions of people around the world.


http://www.lewrockwell.com/miller/miller21.html

How many horsemen are in the Apocalypse derby anyhow? I can see two runners at the moment. sad.gif

This post has been edited by Timothy Osman: Apr 15 2007, 05:55 AM
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lunk
post May 6 2008, 09:16 PM
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Hmm, Carbon Dioxide...

To make this chemical it takes twice as much oxygen as carbon.

If they really wanted to tax this stuff,
they need to go after the main precursor; Oxygen.

That's right, lets have a breathing tax.
Chop down those trees, kill all plant life on land and in the sea.

And if you want to exercise, that requires more oxygen,
so it will cost a little more, to keep fit.

We got to start looking at oxygen as the "crap" used to make CO2.

I can only imagine the joy of an oxygen free environment, a pristine, perfect globe where the weather is always friendly where nobody can complain about it being too warm...

forever and ever, ahem.

sarcastically, lunk

(edit) Wear wood eye bee without spell cheque?

This post has been edited by lunk: May 7 2008, 09:36 AM
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