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New Aerial Nypd Photos Of 9/11 Attack Released, ABC News Obtains 2700+ Photos of WTC via FOIA

rob balsamo
post Feb 10 2010, 11:36 AM
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QUOTE
52 mins ago

NEW YORK Newly released aerial photos of the Sept. 11, 2001, World Trade Center attack show the towers coming down from a dramatic new angle.

The photos were obtained by ABC News, which filed a Freedom of Information Act request with the National Institute of Standards and Technology last year. The NIST collected the images as part of its investigation into the terrorist attack.

ABC said it was provided 2,779 pictures on nine CDs. Many of the photos, taken from police helicopters, have never been released before.

Twelve of the photos appear on ABC's Web site. One photo shows a close-up of the upper floors of the burning towers. Others show the towers' dramatic collapse in a thick plume of smoke and debris and sweeping views of billowing smoke clouds.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100210/ap_on_...s_sept11_photos
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painter
post Feb 10 2010, 12:18 PM
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Note the selection of photos on that yahoo page. A few of the towers being demolished along with hot dog stands, fountain monuments that replicate the flow of the destruction, pictures of 'terrorists' and information about where good citizens can go to be 'educated' about what happened on 9/11. How thoughtful.
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KP50
post Feb 10 2010, 02:50 PM
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I spotted that in the slideshow Sanders, must be just in case anyone has an "Emperor's new clothes" moment and thinks "Hey, that building was blown up!"
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DoYouEverWonder
post Feb 10 2010, 04:26 PM
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Great pics, but they're not new.

They've been out since at least 2004.

Here's the link with the whole series of images, where I found them originally.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/282415/Military-...the-Twin-Towers

These are the same pics I used in my Burning Vehicles research -

What happened to the cars at GZ

This post has been edited by DoYouEverWonder: Feb 10 2010, 04:29 PM
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amazed!
post Feb 10 2010, 07:38 PM
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Yeah Rob, I figured you would have these up over here.

Yes, we've all seen some of them before. Even the NYT said that some had already made it to the internet, and to a book in which the photos were used without permission. Shit happens, and the truth gets out.

But I'm curious as to the spin they're trying to achieve with this. Or, are they trying to deflect criticism somehow?
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Obwon
post Feb 11 2010, 03:45 PM
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QUOTE (amazed! @ Feb 10 2010, 07:38 PM) *
Yeah Rob, I figured you would have these up over here.

Yes, we've all seen some of them before. Even the NYT said that some had already made it to the internet, and to a book in which the photos were used without permission. Shit happens, and the truth gets out.

But I'm curious as to the spin they're trying to achieve with this. Or, are they trying to deflect criticism somehow?


Every once in a while there's a surge of interest in 9-11 and then tens of thousands of people come flooding on to the "wayward/back alley" sites on the web, looking for photos etc., so at various points in time there arises new arguments, or old ones get revitalized/restated in ways that attract more curiosity. It is then that the media has to play catch up to try to cover up how remiss it has been over the years in not covering any of it. Now they can say "we tried, but we were denied access", instead of covering the matter with reports, the way they spend so much time covering worthless anecdotes etc.

In any event, at the time years ago I was asking why no helicopter tried to rescue people from the roof. Instead of being told that the doors were chained shut and padlocked (as we were to learn later) the response was that it was too windy. Well, we know that it was not windy at all, the day was clear and the weather stable. Now we also know that there was a police helicopter already flying around taking pictures, while some 800 people were trapped inside.

They spend so much time telling us, even devoting whole tv shows to "preparedness" of first responders. But, they never think to have anyone around able to handle explosives, in the event that they need to break something down to release people. As any Navy Seal knows a small package of C-4 would have opened those doors and saved many lives. Instead, first responders and their equipment were being deployed to take pictures?

I can't believe it. I would rather believe that the police helicopter pilot and crew, were chomping at the bit, for something to do to save lives any way they could. I'd like to believe that they took the pictures, after waiting for authorization to take some action or other, but those orders never came, because Guiliani was too busy talking to the media instead of attending to his crises management duties.

Any one knows that if no credible/responsible professional or authority can say whether the buildings will fall or not, then the decision must be to err on the side of caution. So the first order, if then Mayor Giuliani was at his post, would have been to order evacuation. If people are trapped, his first order of business is to issue any orders needed to free them. It's not like there was no communications possible with those inside the building. A focused mayor would have learned very early that the doors to the roof were locked. Had the mayor and his chiefs been focused, they'd have at least tried to get explosives up to the roof to open those doors, and then using whatever helicopters they could muster to ferry off as many people as they could. But instead all we saw was what amounted to grandstanding in front of the cameras at every opportunity. It was disgusting!

Hardly a wonder that Giuliani managed to take all of his papers with him when he left office, my guess is, he didn't want anyone to see what he was doing while the towers were burning.

Obwon

This post has been edited by Obwon: Feb 11 2010, 03:56 PM
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DoYouEverWonder
post Feb 11 2010, 04:59 PM
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But instead all we saw was what amounted to grandstanding in front of the cameras at every opportunity. It was disgusting!


Actually, they didn't even do that, until after bother Towers fell. Rudy and Bernie went AWOL by disappearing into 75 Barclay Street, where no one else would know where they were.

This post has been edited by DoYouEverWonder: Feb 11 2010, 04:59 PM
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paranoia
post Feb 11 2010, 06:13 PM
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in response to:

I can't believe it. I would rather believe that the police helicopter pilot and crew, were chomping at the bit, for something to do to save lives any way they could. I'd like to believe that they took the pictures, after waiting for authorization to take some action or other...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wllRNw7OKZY

neverminding the title the youtube poster gave the clip, its a presentation by abcnews' "primetime live" news show, where they interview 2 people from the nypd's 9/11 chopper crew, and attempt to justify/explain their actions (or lackthereof)...

This post has been edited by paranoia: Feb 12 2010, 12:22 AM
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lurker
post Feb 11 2010, 08:25 PM
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forgive me if this has been already discussed and "cleared" some time ago.

picture 1265853257598.jpg of the "new" photos shows some strange object. what is this?

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lurker
post Feb 11 2010, 08:58 PM
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ok, I just checked abc's website for the "newly" released pictures, but

a) found only pictures reduced in size and
b) pics different from the place I got mine (which also are of higher resolution).

abc: abcnews.com

my source:

austrian daily newspager "derstandard": derStandard.at

check them out!
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paranoia
post Feb 12 2010, 12:16 AM
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QUOTE (lurker @ Feb 11 2010, 08:25 PM) *
forgive me if this has been already discussed and "cleared" some time ago.

picture 1265853257598.jpg of the "new" photos shows some strange object. what is this?



its a helicopter. here is a bigger version of that pic:
http://tinypic.com/r/51zehd/6



not sure where i got it, but the file name i found it as was GJS-WTC52, which appears in several places on the net:
http://www.google.com/#hl=en&source=hp...b64f927cfe7b756

This post has been edited by paranoia: Feb 12 2010, 12:18 AM
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Obwon
post Feb 12 2010, 06:37 AM
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QUOTE (DoYouEverWonder @ Feb 11 2010, 04:59 PM) *
Actually, they didn't even do that, until after bother Towers fell. Rudy and Bernie went AWOL by disappearing into 75 Barclay Street, where no one else would know where they were.


How such cowardly acting people ever passed under the public scrutiny barrier, I'll never know, unless it's due to the fact that it's been way too long since we've had to wage a real war against a real and potent enemy. Now it's all make believe enemies, inflating them and their importance to create a platoon of podium\limelight-jockeys and "heros" flying desks. What a shame.

Rudy and Bernie were AWOL when they should have been in command, which would have easily saved lives, with the only question being how many. When it was known, for instance, that firefighters radios weren't working, the command should have ordered firefighters to have at least one policeman accompany each group.

They should have focused on the matter of whether to evacuate or not. That would have been settled the moment Rudy discovered that no one could say that the towers would stand absolutely. Since the slightest hedging or equivocation would mean the order to evacuate should have been given. Instead they seem to be operating on the idea that; maybe they'd fall and maybe they wouldn't, but in either case maybe they should evacuate and maybe they shouldn't. If that's the best set of protocols that first responders can find to operate under, they'd be better off disbanding and saving the public some money. After all such confusion makes them even less effective than lay friends and passersby. In truth they were abandoned by their leadership and that led to many more people dying needlessly.

Instead of being able to run for President, Giuliani should have been rotting in jail.

Ob

This post has been edited by Obwon: Feb 12 2010, 06:39 AM
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amazed!
post Feb 12 2010, 10:40 AM
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Speaking of evacuation and saving lives, a few years ago I ended up spending the better part of an hour talking with a guy who had been in 1 of the towers that day. He worked for AT&Treason at the time, and he and his team were there to check something out for the company.

After the tower was struck, of course it was pandemonium inside. He was fairly well incommunicado because of it. A former Navy type, he decided it was best to get out of the building, with his team.

As they tried to exit, police, or at least men dressed as police, refused to let them leave the building. It reached the point that the police actually locked arms with each other, forming a human chain to prevent anybody from leaving the building.

This man was lucky, as he survived fairly well intact, with a pretty good sized scar on his head.
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tempest2s
post Feb 12 2010, 07:40 PM
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QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Feb 10 2010, 08:36 AM) *

I've had close to one hundred of those photos for over two years now, the majority of them I've upload it here:

http://s39.photobucket.com/albums/e174/tem...mview=slideshow

Here are some high quality Pentagon photos:

http://s39.photobucket.com/albums/e174/tem...mview=slideshow

I'm sure most of you have seen a lot of this photos, but you'll never know.
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amazed!
post Feb 13 2010, 01:50 PM
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Good job by Photobucket!
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Obwon
post Feb 15 2010, 11:45 PM
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QUOTE (amazed! @ Feb 12 2010, 10:40 AM) *
Speaking of evacuation and saving lives, a few years ago I ended up spending the better part of an hour talking with a guy who had been in 1 of the towers that day. He worked for AT&Treason at the time, and he and his team were there to check something out for the company.

After the tower was struck, of course it was pandemonium inside. He was fairly well incommunicado because of it. A former Navy type, he decided it was best to get out of the building, with his team.

As they tried to exit, police, or at least men dressed as police, refused to let them leave the building. It reached the point that the police actually locked arms with each other, forming a human chain to prevent anybody from leaving the building.

This man was lucky, as he survived fairly well intact, with a pretty good sized scar on his head.


I could never understand, why such a simple and critical matter, as "evacuate/not evacuate" was never either debated, discussed, no less ever decided by the "high command".
In this situation it's akin to troops, approaching beaches of a foreign enemy, but their high command has yet not even started to discuss whether or not to invade.

Doesn't anyone find it strange that, what I consider to be the most important decision to be made that day, was never talked about or taken? Or is it just me? Am I just lacking in knowledge? Am I just guessing? Was there something more important for the "high command" to wrestle with? If so, what was it? I don't seem to remember reading about the "high command" ever "wrestling" with anything about 9-11, that is, other than any idea that there might have been explosions going off there.

But, if there were no explosions, how did all those bodies get disassembled and transported these huge horizontal distances away from the buildings? The usual answer is that the jets caused the explosions that did that. But, then you spend a little time thinking about the number of bodies disassembled and blown hundreds of feet away, and you say to yourself "gee, how did it come to pass, that there were so many people in the jets strike zones? The answer of course is that the records show, the floors where the jets struck weren't that highly populated at all. There certainly weren't anywhere near 1,100 people in the strike zones. But hey, if you were trying to cover up something, you'd certainly want to make sure that any remains found outside and away from the towers, could not be easily identified, if at all. Because if you could identify people you could place them and that would be a very bad thing, if they had been blown apart AND were far away from the strike zones.

The impression one can easily get from what happened that day, is that someone wanted as many victims as possible to be killed. I'm sure that's a mistaken impression, cause by all the confusion that ensued. The emergency 9-11 line telling people to stay put, the police and firemen attempting to stop people from leaving the building, all of whom, if they'd obeyed such orders, would no longer be with us. Which brings us back to just how critical a matter evacuation is. Why the highest command levels should be exempt from complicity with any decision, good or bad, with respect to it, is absurd! If they didn't make this decision they were derelict in their duties. As such they have no right to claim any glory! But they did, didn't they?

Obwon
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Omega892R09
post Feb 16 2010, 12:06 PM
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QUOTE (Obwon @ Feb 14 2010, 02:45 AM) *
I could never understand, why such a simple and critical matter, as "evacuate/not evacuate" was never either debated, discussed, no less ever decided by the "high command"....

... The impression one can easily get from what happened that day, is that someone wanted as many victims as possible to be killed. I'm sure that's a mistaken impression, cause by all the confusion that ensued.

For what its worth I consider that survivors were not welcome. Dead men, or women, tell no tails and the perp's wanted as few survivors as possible else too many dots may have become connected. Also I think this was why the WTC2 started down first, early because a fire chief had reported only moments before the collapse that '...two lines could knock it {the fire} down...'.

Then there is the issue of roof spaces being cordoned off and no rooftop evacuations being carried out.

Every thing that happened that day conflicts with the laws of science or normal procedures that would have been in place to cope with the various emergencies that ensued from NORAD down to on the ground in Manhattan.

It was macabre, well planned theatre, Hollywood style, but for real.
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Obwon
post Feb 16 2010, 02:29 PM
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QUOTE (Omega892R09 @ Feb 16 2010, 12:06 PM) *
For what its worth I consider that survivors were not welcome. Dead men, or women, tell no tails and the perp's wanted as few survivors as possible else too many dots may have become connected. Also I think this was why the WTC2 started down first, early because a fire chief had reported only moments before the collapse that '...two lines could knock it {the fire} down...'.

Then there is the issue of roof spaces being cordoned off and no rooftop evacuations being carried out.

Every thing that happened that day conflicts with the laws of science or normal procedures that would have been in place to cope with the various emergencies that ensued from NORAD down to on the ground in Manhattan.

It was macabre, well planned theatre, Hollywood style, but for real.


Truly it was bizarre that day and it's aftermath. I expected that questions would be asked and with no good answers forthcoming a chorus of voices would rise and grow. Instead we got nothing but silence, and that is not the American way, that is the way of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, the one we'd lived and excoriated for decades, came to visit America that day and it's still our unwelcomed guest today.
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KP50
post Feb 16 2010, 04:25 PM
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I find a lot of the actions make sense if you start from the premise that the priority was for the fires to burn so that the collapses could be "explained". If you analyse where explosions were reported,

Explosions in the basement to disable the control system that was there.
On one of the floors that begin with 20 - where the main control system was located.
In the elevators.

Many of these explosions make no sense if you think they were part of the demolition itself. But if they were intended to make it difficult for the fire department to do their job, then it all falls into place. The fire-fighting efforts could not be co-ordinated and firemen had to climb 80 stories to reach the fires. Once the first firemen reached the fires - then the south tower came down.

So my theory about evacuation was not that they wanted to swell the numbers of victims - but that they wanted as much confusion as possible in the stairs of the towers to leave the fires to burn.
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DoYouEverWonder
post Feb 17 2010, 08:34 AM
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QUOTE
I could never understand, why such a simple and critical matter, as "evacuate/not evacuate" was never either debated, discussed, no less ever decided by the "high command".
In this situation it's akin to troops, approaching beaches of a foreign enemy, but their high command has yet not even started to discuss whether or not to invade.


There were some good reasons for telling people to stay in WTC 2, while WTC 1 was being evacuated. It was more important to get the people in the burning building out first.

Second was the problem with falling debris and bodies, so they tried to send people underground and out of WTC 5, to get them away from the complex.

Third, structural steel skyscrapers that have been burning for less then an hour don't normally fail completely, the way the WTC did. So given more time, roof top rescues and other options may have been attempted.
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