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Is Ron Paul Somehow Connected To "illuminati", hand shakes, "horned hand" sign

zetetic0void
post Mar 29 2009, 01:28 PM
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In the past I thought Ron Paul and Dennis Kucinich were two US policiticans who I thought were really on the ball and for truth.

Over time I have seen references to photos and videos showing what look like Freemasonic handshakes and "horned hand" signs (some people explain this as just sign language for "I love you") done by Ron Paul.

I'm left wondering if there is something to these horned hands and masonic handshakes or could they be something else and just interpretted as some sort of "illuminati" signals by some people.


Reading claims about Ron Paul's involvement with many from the John Birch Society (and claims that has ties to secret society) makes me suspicious about whether Ron Paul could actually be a diversion to sort of collect dissenting people's focus.


I'm not sure what to think about these hand signs. On some videos, I think some people are interpretting maybe too many occurances as being some connection to "illuminati" signs. Some obscure heavy metal musician (it's almost odd if they didn't do that LOL) making it doesn't mean as much to me as the Pope or some politician doing it. There's even a photo of the president of Iran giving an allegedly masonic handshake and making two horned hand signs (is that "photoshopped" or is there some custom in Iran making that mean something else?).


It does seem really odd to see a picture of the current Pope giving two horned hands whilst walking (is there any use for that in official Roman Catholic symbology) and seeing presidents of various countries or multiple politicians do it seems to discredit the idea that it's all for some football team in Texas (Bush's use of it often is explained as such even though he's seen doing it at a 911 event and with the Queen of England).



Is there anything to any of this?
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André
post Mar 29 2009, 03:13 PM
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I find his link with CIA Michael Scheuer during the presidential primarys more perplexing, as far as the secret handshakes or the Illuminati is concerned, I do not believe it's worth pursuing since none of it can be proven and in the end is only speculation.

Maybe it's time we stop following leaders, blindly believing "experts", maybe we should make up our own minds based on research, reflection and common sense, instead of submitting ourselves to any kind o ideology, right or left.
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Sanders
post Mar 29 2009, 06:53 PM
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QUOTE (zetetic0void @ Apr 2 2009, 11:28 AM) *
Is there anything to any of this?



No
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FM258
post Mar 29 2009, 08:18 PM
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QUOTE (zetetic0void @ Mar 29 2009, 01:28 PM) *
In the past I thought Ron Paul and Dennis Kucinich were two US policiticans who I thought were really on the ball and for truth.

Over time I have seen references to photos and videos showing what look like Freemasonic handshakes and "horned hand" signs (some people explain this as just sign language for "I love you") done by Ron Paul.


Who the f*ck are you?
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grizz
post Mar 29 2009, 08:24 PM
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QUOTE (André @ Mar 29 2009, 11:13 AM) *
I find his link with CIA Michael Scheuer during the presidential primarys more perplexing, as far as the secret handshakes or the Illuminati is concerned, I do not believe it's worth pursuing since none of it can be proven and in the end is only speculation.

Maybe it's time we stop following leaders, blindly believing "experts", maybe we should make up our own minds based on research, reflection and common sense, instead of submitting ourselves to any kind o ideology, right or left.

I don't care if he's a Mason or not. We should know by now not to put our trust in any politician.

Ron Paul may be the most sincere person in the world, but even then he is being used. Since the election he's been on every TV and radio program in the country that has guests. Hmm... He wasn't good enough to be the Republican candidate, but he's a major talking head now, known around the world.

Ron Paul is the media darling who is leading the charge on the Federal Reserve. He wants to get rid of it, and that's certainly a good idea. Right? But what would replace the Fed? A precious metals standard like he proposes? Not on your life!

The replacement for the Federal Reserve Bank would be the Global Reserve Bank, coincidentally owned by the same global banking cartel. Some back room deals this week in London may seal our fate.
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zetetic0void
post Mar 30 2009, 05:55 AM
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QUOTE
Who the f*ck are you?



Well, that's an odd response!



My post was in relation to alleged ideas that some people have made that Ron Paul was secretly aligned with the 'powers that be' because of some hand signs and seemingly masonic hand signs he's given in public.

I never accused him or said he was anything but it is a valid question to be curious about such accusations. I am bringing up the point for discussion and I want to hear others' opinions about the alleged 'horned hand' signs and if there is something to (at least some of) that.


I've liked everything I've heard from Ron Paul and Dennis Kucinich and I would hate to learn that in reality, Ron Paul was secretly part of the elite's weird scheme in the media.


I think your response was a misunderstanding of my point.

This post has been edited by zetetic0void: Mar 30 2009, 06:00 AM
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FM258
post Mar 30 2009, 09:08 AM
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Naw...thats just how I am with new folks....aint you ever seen Get Shorty?
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zetetic0void
post Mar 30 2009, 10:29 AM
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QUOTE
Naw...thats just how I am with new folks....aint you ever seen Get Shorty?


-------

I'm not familiar with that movie but just searched and found that line


Ronnie Wingate: " Excuse me bro', but who the f%ck are you? "


The reply in the movie apparently was


Chili Palmer: I'm the one tellin' you how it is...

-----------

I'm hoping my thread questioning the idea of some alleged Ron Paul 'horned hand' or Illuminati handshakes doesn't turn out to be "telling how it is". I would hate to find out Ron Paul is actually secretly on the other team ;-)


I'm just hoping to get ideas and to find out if it's true or not or other peoples' thoughts on this idea.
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Cary
post Mar 30 2009, 10:56 AM
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QUOTE (FM258 @ Mar 27 2009, 12:18 PM) *
Who the f*ck are you?



I second FM's question. You some kind of trouble maker?
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zetetic0void
post Mar 30 2009, 11:56 AM
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QUOTE
I second FM's question. You some kind of trouble maker?



If creating a post asking opinions about alleged information is making trouble, then I'm a trouble maker rolleyes.gif


I wasn't stating definately that I thought Ron Paul was an Illuminati... I was merely asking about the idea to get peoples' thoughts on the matter.


If you think he isn't , I'd like to see information as to why since I really like to think at least some politicians are actually truthful.


I don't see how what I wrote could be seen as anything other than an honest question... in fact the automatic refusual to even consider such ideas may be a most dangerous thing.
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FM258
post Mar 30 2009, 12:23 PM
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Well, you are new here and to be asking a question like this pretty odd.

Ron Paul is in his 70s, this is most likely his last term in office. He has nothing to gain by destroying a lifelong reputation of honesty and integrity. Anyone who has been around longer than a few months knows RP is the greatest champion of the Constitution and personal freedom this country has, and to raise a question to his credibility is like me asking the forum if your mother really is a skanky crack whore who takes it in the ass....now I'm not saying she does!!! Im just asking what if!

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zetetic0void
post Mar 30 2009, 12:52 PM
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So perhaps your concern is that I am some sort of trouble making troll because I am relatively new and this post appears to be something a troll might try to state to discredit Ron Paul?

I don't want to discredit Ron Paul ... everything he's said is so 'spot on'.


I don't say I believe Ron Paul is an illuminati... I just brought up the question to get input so I can find out more about this and hopefully (ideally) to feel confidant that there is not any credibility to the idea that he's an Illuminati.


I never intended my post to give the impression that I was definately stating he was Illuminati.




When I see photos of some heavy metal singer making the 'horned hand', I don't think much of it other than a stage accessory .... but when I see photos of Bill Clinton, George Bush, the Pope, and other politicians world wide make that, I am suspicious.

Are some of these photos photoshopped? Why is Geoge Bush making it whilst standing next to the Queen or at a 911 event? (these can hardly fall into the explaination often given of being references to some Texas football team)


Maybe I should have searched more for Ron Paul here but I still think it's a valid question for inquiry.
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FM258
post Mar 30 2009, 02:00 PM
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You are the starter of this topic, if you didnt mean to accuse Paul of being Illuminati, you should have made the title "Something I just pulled out of my ass"


I never said you couldnt or shouldnt accuse anyone, noone is above scrutiny,...but if you are going to put forth something this divisive, you better attach some evidence to the fact, or you are just trying to stir up a shitpot.

Do you "get it"?
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grizz
post Mar 30 2009, 02:34 PM
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I'm moving this to debate.

Please remain calm.
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zetetic0void
post Mar 30 2009, 03:47 PM
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QUOTE
You are the starter of this topic, if you didnt mean to accuse Paul of being Illuminati, you should have made the title "Something I just pulled out of my ass"



The thread title has the word "Is" at the beginning. That implies a question and not a definate statement of my opinion. This thread is a question. How can my thread title be interpretted as a concrete accusation of Ron Paul?


It is merely a question in the hopes of gaining more knowledge.


I ended with "Is there anything to any of this?"



QUOTE
I never said you couldn't or shouldnt accuse anyone, noone is above scrutiny,...but if you are going to put forth something this divisive, you better attach some evidence to the fact, or you are just trying to stir up a shitpot.

Do you "get it"?



I thought most people here probably saw pictures like this already and might have investigated such alleged claims more thoroughly than I did so that's why I didn't post photos.


QUOTE
and to raise a question to his credibility is like me asking the forum if your mother really is a skanky crack whore who takes it in the ass....now I'm not saying she does!!! Im just asking what if!



That's a rather poor "discussion" tactic that I would have hoped wouldn't exist here.

--------------------
I've listened to many Ron Paul vids on youtube and I agree with him and Dennis Kucinich. It's just when I saw some photos claiming he was giving the 'horned hand' or a masonic handshake on TV, it became an issue I hoped wasn't a bad sign. I figured many people here would have information to clarify this.

-----------------

I do not wish to argue about the intention of this thread as I have repeatedly stated it was merely a question and I feel the words used in the original post and thread title should show that fact.
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FM258
post Mar 30 2009, 03:55 PM
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QUOTE
Is Ron Paul Somehow Connected To "illuminati"
hand shakes, "horned hand" sign


QUOTE
I thought most people here probably saw pictures like this already and might have investigated such alleged claims more thoroughly than I did so that's why I didn't post photos.


Why havent you bothered including some of these pics?...hell, maybe he is Illuminati! Maybe i'm Illuminati, getting mad at you saying Paul is Illuminati to throw you off my tracks?

Maybe Rob is Illuminati! What a great front hes possibly using?

Cary could possibly might be Illuminati as well...he sometimes possibly acts strangely sometimes maybe.

OK Im done, next. whistle.gif
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painter
post Mar 30 2009, 04:04 PM
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First, define "Illuminati" -- without that this whole discussion is worse than useless, it is disruptive.

It's like discussing whether or not "God" exists when there is no agreement among the participants of what "God" is or might be (or how such existence might be proven or disproved). Moreover, it is loaded with emotional attachments that, as we see here, quickly become volatile. Examine why that is and why anyone would want to stir them up here. THAT might make a truly interesting, meaningful and manageable discussion because at least in that instance we would have something to go on -- our own observation of how our emotions work and how they get attached to particular belief systems.
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grizz
post Mar 30 2009, 04:20 PM
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There are very few pictures of Ron Paul supposedly giving signals, and endless speculation regarding these pictures. As I stated earlier, to me it doesn't matter if he's a Mason or not. I'm just posting these photos so we all know what we're talking about.

Here's the handshake.



And here's the hand signal.





Note that in both of these pictures, his thumb is extended. So, it could mean 'I love you' in sign, which is a combination of 'I' and 'L'.
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grizz
post Mar 30 2009, 04:34 PM
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Ron Paul's dad was a Mason, and Dr Paul has expressed respect for the organization and attended public meetings at his local lodge. His wife is a member of Eastern Star and his daughters were Rainbow Girls. As far as I can tell, that's the extent of the 'evidence'.

Like so many of these urban legends, there is no proof. Just evidence. It's up to each individual as to how much the evidence translates to proof for him/herself..

Again, I don't care if he's a Mason or not. I'm just putting this here because nobody else is presenting anything of substance.
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grizz
post Mar 30 2009, 05:11 PM
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Personally, I think that Ron Paul is a great man, even though he gets a big fat fail regarding 9/11. But my feelings about him or anyone else does not make that person immune to question or even attack. If Ron Paul is not a Mason, cool. If he is, so what? My grandpa was a Mason, and he was a great guy, a fine upstanding Christian, as most lower order Masons are.

Conspiracy theories are the same as the blame game. Find out who done it and blame them. Not us. Don't blame us. Blame them. It's the Masons, the Illuminati, the Jesuits, the Neocons, the Zionists, the Bankers, the Crown. In fact, it is none of those. They are all front organizations, distractions.

At the top of the pyramid are a tiny few, unknown to us commoners. Even the Elite don't know them. The evil that they worship is unbounded. Some call it Satan. Nutty as it may sound, I do believe that they practice human sacrifice and other magic to manifest the Adversary.

But their magic is weak, because it is not based in Love. So they have to build a pyramid of reinforcement, to dupe countless souls into repeating their rituals. That's what the silly things the Masons and Eastern Star do is about. The member just thinks it's a quaint ceremony, whereas in reality it is a mirror of ancient secret ritual, meant to magnify by repetition. That's what the pyramid on the back of the one dollar bill is about. Every time someone sees that they send a signal into the void. Pop culture, 'nuff said. Not to mention the fact that they need lots of bloodletting.

Those at the top of the pyramid depend on us, all of us, to reinforce their rituals. The entire world view has been constructed as such a matrix. Here we are, living our lives, and unknowingly amplifying the darkness.
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