A Public Apology To Christopher A Brown, From Painter Options

[painter]

Dear Christopher A Brown, AKA Christophera,

I want to publicly apologize for a variety of slights, insults and injuries against you and your research that have accumulated over a long period of years.

1. A complete inability on my part to grasp the significance of your WTC concrete core hypotheses and the evidence you provided for it dating back to the 9/11 forum at Democratic Underground and elsewhere.
2. The development within myself of a prejudice toward you and the information you presented as being disinformation that, at best, had little significant grounds for genuine consideration.
3. The carrying of this prejudice into my role as an Administrator of the Loose Change Forum where I banned you in October 2006.
4. The further threat of banning you from the Pilots for 9/11 Truth Forum based on this long established prejudice as expressed in this thread and this one.

I hope that you will accept my sincere apology. I've spent much of the day reading through information on your web site: http://algoxy.com/psych/9-11scenario.html where I have watched your two videos and listened to a good portion of your 2007 interview with Fintan Dunne, which I make available to the members of this forum below:

Fintan Dune Interview MP3

I can not at this moment say that I fully embrace your concrete core hypothesis, however, I can say that I am strongly persuaded to accept it and that I at a point where I am willing to take it seriously, including contemplating the significance it may have for the 9/11 Truth movement as a whole.

Again I offer my sincerest apology in hopes that we can continue to pursue this question of the WTC construction openly and without further animosity between us.

painter

[albertchampion]

i am new to christopher brown's analysis. but i have monitored the objections to his insights on this sight.

now, having listened to him, i hear my take on the take-downs.

as a forensic metallurgist, i would love to have some evidence - but the state has destroyed virtually all of that.

as i wrote years ago on rense.com, these buildings were pre-wired for demolition. many thought me to be wearing a tinfoil hat. listening to this interview, mr brown has persuaded me that my hat is just a regular felt fedora.

mr brown, i think, was involved in the construction of these 'scrapers.

[painter]

. . .
I'm a bit confused about the core construction after seeing Richard Gage's account and diagrams. I have not studied the blueprints, however all other presentations show/explain 47 steel columns at the center of the buildings.

Is this what is being contested?

Yes. You should follow the links to Christopher's threads, above. The blue prints we have were "leaked" to professor Jones. Christopher has brought forward questions regarding the veracity of those drawings and the significance of their general acceptance, even within, if not especially within, the 9/11 truth community. Those of us here who have followed the FDR analysis fully understand that government agencies do provide falsified information, even via FOIA requests. This instance is a bit different:
http://www.infowars.com/articles/sept11/wt...istleblower.htm as the documents we have were "leaked" and have been accepted as factual blue prints -- in part because they show features which cast further doubt upon both FEMA and NIST's investigations. In other words, even with the blue prints we have, total global collapse remains not only unlikely but physically impossible. However, the mechanism of demolition remains in doubt. Christopher's hypothesis provides a mechanism and also explains the volume of particulate matter observed instantaneously with the onset of demolition. You'll have to examine the threads to determine for yourself whether or not Christopher's hypothesis is sufficiently substantiated and, if it is, consider what this and the fact that it is not widely accepted means for us.

At this point, I would like to see Richard Gage et. al., review this information a little more closely. I can imagine a scenario where it is given its due place as an alternate hypothesis based on the factual observation that the public had been denied access to the blue prints until they were "leaked," perhaps unsympathetically. In other words, we can not assume that the leaked documents are accurate even if they are the plans FEMA and NIST used in their investigations -- any more than we can assume the accuracy of the Flt 77 FDR data which the NTSB allegedly used to create their Flight Path Study cited by the 9/11 Commission.

It always somewhat begs the question, especially with the Pentagon, if they were going to go to all the trouble to fake the FDR data, why not do so in such a way that it corroborated the observed damage? I think the simple answer is, they can't -- and they can't because of the way the Pentagon crash was staged as a near horizontal, ground level event.

With the WTC the problem is similar. When it is all boiled down, so far as I understand it, what NIST concludes is that "collapse" could not have been initiated by the fire alone had the insulation on the supporting structure not been widely dislodged during impact. They don't look at collapse sequence, only initiation and even there they have to grasp at straws to explain. A concrete core would remove even this. They would have to explain almost instantaneous and catastrophic structural failure of a concrete core.

In the case of the Pentagon, the NTSB hasn't even bothered to attempt to explain any anomalies regarding the FDR data and the Flight Path Study generated from it. They just stone wall.

[Christophera]

Dear Christopher A Brown, AKA Christophera,

I want to publicly apologize for a variety of slights, insults and injuries against you and your research that have accumulated over a long period of years.

1. A complete inability on my part to grasp the significance of your WTC concrete core hypotheses and the evidence you provided for it dating back to the 9/11 forum at Democratic Underground and elsewhere.
2. The development within myself of a prejudice toward you and the information you presented as being disinformation that, at best, had little significant grounds for genuine consideration.
3. The carrying of this prejudice into my role as an Administrator of the Loose Change Forum where I banned you in October 2006.
4. The further threat of banning you from the Pilots for 9/11 Truth Forum based on this long established prejudice as expressed in this thread and this one.

I hope that you will accept my sincere apology. I've spent much of the day reading through information on your web site: http://algoxy.com/psych/9-11scenario.html where I have watched your two videos and listened to a good portion of your 2007 interview with Fintan Dunne.

Again I offer my sincerest apology in hopes that we can continue to pursue this question of the WTC construction openly and without further animosity between us.

painter

Fully accepted Painter,

I well understand the myriad of influences which you are likely to respond to. I'm just thanking god somebody finally understood the prejudice against the information of the concrete core that was default application by the 9-11 truth community.

The reason I put my 9-11 site in the directory labeled /psych/ is because I understood in 2003 that the truth of what happened inspires massive cognitive dissonance on a mass level, built to demolish. Suddenly we don't know anything about our world. Emotionally, spiritually, what happened was a sick imposition of a ritual whereupon we witness mommy and daddy kill brother and sister so they can blame it on the nieghbor and attack them and rob them, and then, ......... they covertly compel us to be quiet about it.

So that whole drama has been fueling the public, generally. You get the reactive spinoff in forums of people trying to be activists and a very strange element that is somehow active, but conditionally. Only certain forms of truth seeking are worthy, only certain information is acceptable; and a group seems to support them, seems to be getting bigger; and that is all you know, all anybody knows no matter what nonsense it is. One guy, alone seeming to type CONCRETE over and over, is hardly going to be accepted as "obviously bringing hyper accurate information".
In the worst case, everybody assumes the information of the group is correct, some agency says it's correct, those people did a study with the data, others accepted it, the data must be correct. That has happened and it is no accident. It is called "consistency over evidence", with enough people, in an impersonal environment such as the web, it can be done and has been done.

Be sure that there were think tank studies done in the intelligence community back in the early 1970's, then with the first networks. They know exactly what they can do with perceptions and attitudes.

Meaning only reason over time can prevail. I copied up your rules and posted them in debate. Carl and you were getting oppressive in the thread so I decided to leave you with some of your own reasoning (the Alternative theory forum disinfo rule), which, .... by the way is pretty dam well expressed. I saw that, ....... and said to myself that "others think like I think" (not always true by any means), particularly in this case if they are sincere; and that anyone that would write such rules, while bashing no planers, logically ought to be okay.

I decided to test that theory and you've passed the test. I copied up your rules and posted them in debate. Then I let them sit there for some months, returning a bit at first. I trashed the opposition at breakfornews.com (BFN) with an image posted at myspace I'd never seen before showing the core wall at its base with a hallway running along inside the massive concrete wall where there should be a bank of elevators. BFN got boring so I came back here to try again.

Curious how when you basically know how a building was put together and you see picture of it 15 years later, you can actually figure it out. Of course my opposition doesn't know about the building, if they are sincere opposition, so they often provide me with evidence. myspace came through, .... who, da thunk it. I posted it here when I returned and started reverse engineering your Alternative theory forum disinfo rule and using it to show you what you were doing.

Thank you for seeing it, very much.

jackx at Loose change gave me a good one. An image showing the elevator pit that showed the FOOTING ZONE OF THE CORE WALL and only grillage in the core area which has no lateral strength. How does that work with the many images of the spire, a box column outside and fastened to the concrete core?

We can definitely continue to pursue this question of the WTC construction openly and without further animosity between us.

Christopher A. Brown

[Christophera]

It's nice to see the good guys sticking together.

A very interesting theory explained in the video.

I'm a bit confused about the core construction after seeing Richard Gage's account and diagrams.

The inner tube of the "Tube in a tube design" core was a single, giant (80x120),steel reinforced cast concrete rectangular tube1,350 feet tall(wtc1 only)). Like a smokestack or silo or cooling tower, but only built to be strong, resisting sway and torsion in up to 120 MPH winds.

The outer tube was a steel framework supporting floors. The spire is one of the columns of the inner wall of the outer steel framed tube.

This post has been edited by Christophera: Apr 26 2008, 03:50 AM

[rcane]

Has anyone compared this to a more recent program on either the history channel or discovery channel about the construction of WTC 1 & 2? I wasn't a 9/11 special--more like modern marvels.


I'd like to see that original PBS show found.

[Christophera]

Has anyone compared this to a more recent program on either the history channel or discovery channel about the construction of WTC 1 & 2? I wasn't a 9/11 special--more like modern marvels.


I'd like to see that original PBS show found.

PBS actually re-edited the documentary in 2003 and removed all of the concrete core information. (also infiltrated) A librarian in a small town thought she had a copy. She went to find it and it was gone. She remembered a phone call from PBS "Do you have a copy of the "Engineering and Construction of the twin towers?"
The librarian answered "Yes"
PBS, "If you send us your old VHS copy we will send you a new DVD of the redited version free of charge."
The librarian declined the offer, kept the VHS and ordered the DVD. Then didn't learn the original VHS was gone until 2007.

[dMz]

Dear Christopher A Brown, AKA Christophera,

I want to publicly apologize for a variety of slights, insults and injuries against you and your research that have accumulated over a long period of years.

Well played painter...

Although I haven't yet viewed most of Christopher's info, that was a VERY classy apology. I haven't seen many persons who have both the balls and the integrity to publicly pen such an apology in this day&age. Now I suppose that I am obligated to go figure out what the apology was based upon...

Thanx painter [I think...] (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/ohmy.gif)

d

P.S. Have we passed a 911TM milestone or something (years later)?

[amazed!]

Yes Painter, very well done indeed. A class act all the way! (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/salute.gif)

And for Christopher, thank you for informing us. I've been reading your stuff since you got here and thought it made sense to me, NOT an engineer.

On my own I had wondered all along about the possibility of the buildings having been built to be destroyed thusly. Just a hunch, and now apparently likely.

As a Floridian, I had been to those buildings and Windows on the World maybe a dozen times. Each time, the place gave the the creeps, and I was always relieved to get the hell out of there.

[lunk]

The sun is shining today,
I'm glad.

onward, lunk

[rob balsamo]

Attaboy painter.... (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Such a great team here. P4T is very lucky.

[Omega892R09]

On my own I had wondered all along about the possibility of the buildings having been built to be destroyed thusly. Just a hunch, and now apparently likely.

I had put such thinking into words on the RD Forum and was immediately jumped on, not that that bothered me overmuch. I was sort of thinking aloud as it were.

Well done Painter. I have been pondering Christophera’s postings since I first saw then awhile back and am undecided in toto.

[Carl Bank]

Our Painter - What a character!

I was (and still am) always a little against Chris for posting it
all over the place and not trying to be symphatetic at the
same time. It sounded way to pathetic and like kind of disinfo to me, at least.

Anyway, Painters apology is actually the best advertisement any post
ever could get, so I supose that I (and many others) will look into it.

I got no idea, how this will develop. But I saw, that David Icke had
him on his forum. Maybe we will apologize for dismissing more 9/11/NWO-related theories
in the next time. NPT, Chemtrails, Video Fakery, Shape Shifting Lizards... name it

For the moment, I will take painters word for it and hold back from argueing
about it until I got some grip on that (concrete-)ground.


dunno: Carl

[amazed!]

Just watched the videos, and THANK YOU CHRISTOPHER!

That is an awesome presentation.

Shows how long the wicked fokkers have been around.

I wonder what percentage of the crew that installed those explosive charges still lives today?

I always did get the creeps in those buildings.

[Christophera]

Our Painter - What a character!

I was (and still am) always a little against Chris for posting it
all over the place and not trying to be symphatetic at the
same time. It sounded way to pathetic and lie kind of disinfo to me, at least.

Anyway, Painters apology is actually the best advertisement any post
ever could get, so I supose that I (and many others) will look into it.

I got no idea, how this will develop. But I saw, that David Icke had
him on his forum. Maybe we will apologize for dismissing more 9/11/NWO-related theories
in the next time. NPT, Chemtrails, Video Fakery, Shape Shifting Lizards... name it

For the moment, I will take painters word for it and hold back from argueing
about it until I got some grip on that (concrete-)ground.


dunno: Carl

I'm unsure whether to post in explanation of your concerns will be interpreted as a lack of respect, but it needs to be done. In the below thread you will find a detailed reasoning for the focused discussion on the concrete core.

http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....40&start=40

Painters apology shows huge respect for the truth and we shall all be indebted to him for that, as will be shown by events of the future IF we focus on getting the greater truth at THIS TIME.

Meaning that "NPT, Chemtrails, Video Fakery, Shape Shifting Lizards" don't qualify now. We have a simple but nefarious lie by a major federal agency that conceals information critical to a competent intitial analysis of collapse which is in reality the largest instant of covert mass murder in human history.

Has Carl Banks taken on truth movement single handed in an effort to correct it and direct it towards the success it claims it is after? No. If Carl banks did and did so against a psyops that was funded and conducted by infiltrators of the US government, and did so with absolute certainty, I'm absolutely certain that Carl Banks would sound pretty shrill and pathetic after 6 years too.

Thanks for the understanding and acceptence Carl. I sense you have respect and reverence for the US Constitution. Allow me to emphasize what is really happening right here with Painters apology with regard to the Constitution.

Painter of P4T has actually allowed the greater meaning of free speech to begin to manifest and reason has completely controlled that act. A very commendable human attribute. I've learned the greater meaning of free speech and as far as I can reasonably and logically determine, we need to amend the bill of rights to include it.

THE GREATER MEANING OF FREE SPEECH:
The meaning is found through an understanding that can be created with empowered sharing. The understanding creates; foregiveness, tolerence, acceptence, respect, trust, friendship and love; protecting life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

[Christophera]

Just watched the videos, and THANK YOU CHRISTOPHER!

That is an awesome presentation.

Shows how long the wicked fokkers have been around.

I wonder what percentage of the crew that installed those explosive charges still lives today?

I always did get the creeps in those buildings.

You are so welcome. THX for the feedback.

Yes, our history is far different than we think it is. Elements that seek to control us have been around for a long time.

I remember hearing that when bomb sniffing dogs were first implimented after the 1993 bombing that special dogs had to be found or trained because the dogs were constantly signalling the presence of explosives. . i believe it was a news media story

I would like an inquiry to go out regarding that to see if others remember it.

Those doing the work for the most part probaly did not know what that coating on the rebar was. The reason only welders with a security celarance were allowed to make the butt weld on the 3 inch vertical rebar is because they had to know. A welder that didn't know might cut corners on removal of the "special plastic coating" or skimp on shielding. BOOM, the entire detonates. Very hard to explain.

[amazed!]

It would be interesting to know the actual role of Rudy's boys over in 7

They must have had some role in the action, and that's why 7 was also destroyed.

It really was superb execution, except they took down the wrong building first maybe? (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

[Omega892R09]

I remember hearing that when bomb sniffing dogs were first implimented after the 1993 bombing that special dogs had to be found or trained because the dogs were constantly signalling the presence of explosives. . i believe it was a news media story

I would like an inquiry to go out regarding that to see if others remember it.

Whatever report that was if it isn't buried it will be RSN.

I have looked, and looked and looked at the pictures with the sun behind the towers and cannot make out the concrete core you mention, sorry.

Don't bother reposting the pics here as I have your site, and the previous thread here to refer to.

Are there not folk still alive who worked on the construction and who would recall details?

[Sanders]

Watched the vids, very interesting, Christophera.

I'll only add that I have no particular problem with the idea that 9-11 was planned that long ago. I've thought for a long time that a decision to shift the focus of who the big enemy was away from the Soviet Union and to the Muslim world was likely made as early as the 70's.

Ironic that the twin towers (I think they were nicknamed Nelson and David) were completed in 73. That's the year Brzezinski & Rockeller founded the Trilateral Commission - from which member Jimmy Carter would be selected to run for president. Brzezinski, as everyone knows, would serve as his National Security Advisor, a position from which he would start the ball rolling along the Soviet Afghanistan border. The rest is history, as they say, the history of the fomation of the global war on terror that is.

Not saying I'm convinced that plastic explosives were waiting in those towers all that time, I have no idea. But the thought really makes one shudder.

[Quest]

"Fintan Dune Interview MP3"

A great interview.