OGCT True Believers Bullshit Excuses, Need help to sink OGCT True Believers BS Excuses Options

[dMz]

Another resource to answer the OCT loyalists:

http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index.php?showtopic=8948

And another:

http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....showtopic=13088

[Wibble]

Hang on a minute, why was Nicepants banned?

Most of the posts be the Truther movement types were just insults aimed at him "playing the man not the ball" yet he gets banned? This is bullying, not a quest for truth. When are you going to answer all his questions?

[Wibble]

30 train cars hit head on with 70 in the opposite direction. Im sure the first few wont survive on either side. But will the 30 plow through all 70 on the other side one by one? According to micepants, he says yes...

There is no gravity acting on the 30 train cars so this is not an accurate comparisson. If the 30 train car were going down a steep hill it would be a more accurate comparrisson and yes the 30 trains could plough on through to the bottom of the hill.

[rob balsamo]

...yes the 30 trains could plough on through to the bottom of the hill.

So... you're saying a mass can plow through something more than twice its mass as long as it has gravity acting on it? Is this what you're saying?

[Sanders]

Hang on a minute, why was Nicepants banned?

Most of the posts be the Truther movement types were just insults aimed at him "playing the man not the ball" yet he gets banned? This is bullying, not a quest for truth. When are you going to answer all his questions?

I banned Nicepants because he was getting on the nerves of the other members, because he was wasting our time, because I know basically who and what he is and don't believe in allowing one's enemy into one's own tent, but mostly because he was not sincere ... I'm all for honest debate, but nicepants never really cared about having his questions answered, he just wanted to try and trip us up and win points (over at his home board).

And, I answered many of Nicepants' questions, as did several other posters. Nicepants never answered any of ours though, did he?

[Wibble]

...yes the 30 trains could plough on through to the bottom of the hill.

So... you're saying a mass can plow through something more than twice its mass as long as it has gravity acting on it? Is this what you're saying?

Bad English, it would not plough through but could it cause the 70 train cars to compress into each other? Yes.

Are you saying gravity would have no affect on the equation?




Regarding whether gravity can cause something to go sideways......The other day I was in my kitchen and knocked (just the slightest touch and it fell) a spoon off the counter. Is it fell down it started to spin slowly and knocked into the side of one of the cupboards and then flew across the room. I am sure we have all done something similar. Did gravity cause the spoon to no be a meter or so away or was it CD? Scale this up and you have a lump of metal falling from the twin towers.

[rob balsamo]

Bad English, it would not plough through but could it cause the 70 train cars to compress into each other? Yes.

Are you saying gravity would have no affect on the equation?

More than "bad english" im sure. I was hoping you'd say that.. .and pretty much knew you would... (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)


Troy had a great video for this moment, funny sh*t too.. but its gone now... oh well...

However, you can see a picture of him getting ready to "compress" his blocks by dropping blocks on top...

http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....p=0&#entry0

(pssst, the blocks didnt compress... jackass.. i guess there was no gravity involved in that one... (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) )


So, if they would "compress", why did the NIST abandon the "pancake theory"?

[dMz]

There is no gravity acting on the 30 train cars so this is not an accurate comparisson.

So are you claiming that there is no gravity acting on 30 train cars then Wibble? What is holding them on the tracks?

If you can shield 30 train cars from gravity, I am highly interested in that process. I could probably make some money and inventions (and likely obsolete the airline industry) with technology like that. (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

[Wibble]

There is no gravity acting on the 30 train cars so this is not an accurate comparisson.

So are you claiming that there is no gravity acting on 30 train cars then Wibble? What is holding them on the tracks?

If you can shield 30 train cars from gravity, I am highly interested in that process. I could probably make some money and inventions (and likely obsolete the airline industry) with technology like that. (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

Of course I not and you know it. I though this was the place of serious debate?

Are you saying gravity would have no affect on the equation?

Just repeating my question.

So, if they would "compress", why did the NIST abandon the "pancake theory"?

There are several theories why. What is yours? Does it fit in with your magic spoon in your kitchen_

[dMz]

Of course I not and you know it. I though this was the place of serious debate?

"Serious debate" is your choice of words. I typically debate based upon logic, pointed questions, and the laws of physics and other sciences, but that's just how I roll. (Lemme guess- you will again call that "waffle" Wibble).

Are you saying gravity would have no affect on the equation?

Just repeating my question.

Not my quote or relevant to my reply, but it certainly looks like you "spun" it that way the way the quote tags were "worked." Read back through the thread, looking at poster name and post #, and possibly number and address your questions to the relevant people, to save some [circular] confusion.

So, if they would "compress", why did the NIST abandon the "pancake theory"?

There are several theories why. What is yours? Does it fit in with your magic spoon in your kitchen_
Not my quote or relevant to my reply. What is this "magic spoon" of which you speak?

[dMz]

Hang on a minute, why was Nicepants banned?

Most of the posts be the Truther movement types were just insults aimed at him "playing the man not the ball" yet he gets banned? This is bullying, not a quest for truth. When are you going to answer all his questions?

You seem sad Wibble, was nicepants an associate or friend of yours?

Pointed [and numbered] questions are "just insults" then? OK- I think most of us can see how you "play... ball" by now. Care to answer our as yet unanswered questions directly Wibble?

Post #151
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10741672

Post #158
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10741861

Post #172
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10742326

Post #173
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10742339

Post #175
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10742342

Post #194
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10742407

Post #197
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10742429

Post #201
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10742439

Post #208
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10742473

Post #212
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10742532

Post #213
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10742533

Post #215
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10742552

Post #217
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10742576

Post #229
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10742628

Post #237
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10742693

Post #240
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10742764

Post #243
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10742803

A present for Wiggles (post #251)
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10742868

Post #265
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10743068

OK- that brings us up to Wiggles' post #274 today on this thread. We will need to re-number the above sequence- many of them were not numbered in the original list.

You can just refer to the original post and quote the question(s) IN FULL CONTEXT this time in your replies Wiggles.

[Wibble]

I typically debate based upon logic, pointed questions, and the laws of physics and other sciences, but that's just how I roll. (Lemme guess- you will again call that "waffle" Wibble).

This really is just a big game to you isn't it?

Go back and read it again. Rob was to trying to compare 30 train cars hitting 70 train cars to the 30 floors of the WTC falling then compressing/compacting or whatever the other 70. What his train cars theory forgets in the case of the WTC is that gravity is affecting all the floor in a manner that assist the buildings collapsing, where as in the train cars example gravity is pulling in a different direction by 90 degrees. Therefore, his train cars comparison is deeply floored.

[bill]

"deeply floored"



(IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)


(IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/laughing1.gif)

[Sanders]

Rob was to trying to compare 30 train cars hitting 70 train cars to the 30 floors of the WTC falling then compressing/compacting or whatever the other 70. What his train cars theory forgets in the case of the WTC is that gravity is affecting all the floor in a manner that assist the buildings collapsing, where as in the train cars example gravity is pulling in a different direction by 90 degrees. Therefore, his train cars comparison is deeply floored.

Rob's anology is just that, an anology ... anologies never exactly mirror what they attempt to make easier to visualise, if they did they wouldn't be helpful. Forget about gravity in the train anology, the energy source is the driving power of the train itself, the locomotive or whatever (where I live the trains are electric, all the cars are powered). Then imagine how much energy it would take for 30 cars to plow through 70. (It's interesting, because what you discover is that the 30 cars will destroy themselves in the process of trying to plow through the rest ... not unlike what happened at the WTC, even though the reason why that happened in NY is different. If the 30 train cars destroy themselves crashing into the first 30 or 40 of the other 70 cars, what's left to push through the last ones? Nothing! Same with the WTC - there was nothing left after the collapse - all dust and small pieces.)

Returning to the towers, in this case gravity is supposedly the driving force. Are you suggesting that the energy of the powered train in Rob's analogy would be less than the gravity acting on the top 30 floors in the tower example, which start out stationary and initially carry no momentum? Seriously?

[Wibble]

Nothing! Same with the WTC - there was nothing left after the collapse - all dust and small pieces.)

Well that is BS for a start, there was plenty of large debris.

Are you suggesting that the energy of the powered train in Rob's analogy would be less than the gravity acting on the top 30 floors in the tower example

That is not the issue. Gravity provides a constant force the energy in/on the trains would change. It is a poor anology and as already stated if the trains were on a steep slope it would be better.

So on a steep slope with the 30 cars moving down the slope would the 30 cars have more, less or the same the same force as the 30 trains on a flat track?

[dMz]

This really is just a big game to you isn't it?

Go back and read it again. Rob was to trying to compare 30 train cars hitting 70 train cars to the 30 floors of the WTC falling then compressing/compacting or whatever the other 70. What his train cars theory forgets in the case of the WTC is that gravity is affecting all the floor in a manner that assist the buildings collapsing, where as in the train cars example gravity is pulling in a different direction by 90 degrees. Therefore, his train cars comparison is deeply floored.

No, but you really are a big joke in my estimation, Wiggles. You argue with sophist, vague, handwaving, unsourced appeal to "science" yet you don't appear to know much science.

Please note that I have since termed you Wiggle/Wiggles due to your repeated, demonstrated "wiggling" out of answering the direct questions (numbering about 80 by now just here) on this and several other threads. You can call it ad hominem or whatever you must to justify it to yourself Wiggles, but as soon as you start answering questions directly rather than "wiggling" out of them, I might reconsider this.

How are your calculations coming on the cumulative mass of that barium coating on those flourescent light bulbs that you brought to this debate Wiggles? I'm still waiting...

Have you read up on quotes & keeping them in context yet Wiggle?

Here's a little more research for Wiggle. Why don't you read the following and see if it reminds you of anyone Wiggle:

http://www.matriots.com/bh/25.html

Also, I'm having some serious computer trouble Wiggle, so in case I'm not online for a while let me just say "You win. You're cool. In fact, you're my hero. When I grow up I want to be just like Wiggles." (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

If I don't get a chance to say Buh-bye to you Wiggles, I'd like to dedicate this song to you:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=00t8TbYizI0

[The artful dodge...]

Hmmmm <-- scratches chin in obvious puzzlement....

Nicepanties disappears and lo and behold Wibble appears.

A lot of time and effort (including this post) is expended on trolls. Perhaps we should feel sorry for them, after all some of them are working nefariously for the other side but surely that cannot be true of all of them. In which case some of these poor saps are doing it for nothing at all except perhaps the hope that their efforts will be noticed and somehow rewarded.

Perhaps we should consider Mr Chomsky on this matter "If we don't believe in freedom of expression for
people we despise, we don't believe in it at all." If this is the case then, rather than banning them, perhaps we should just ignore them. Let them post to their hearts content, let them start their own threads and let them spout nonsense at each other instead of the rest of us.

On an unrelated note - The power of gravity seems to be the only force that we're supposed to consider in these collapses. Now, I confess my ignorance of physics and will, accordingly, accept my own stupidity for asking this, but... If a chunk of, say, thirty stories breaks loose at the top of the tower and each floor is approximately 12 feet apart then is it actually possible for enough momentum to be gained in a fall of 12 feet to cause a global collapse of all the undamaged floors below. Surely the downward momentum would be arrested - even slightly - after the first floor and then progressively more at the second etc and the whole thing would grind to a halt long before it reached the ground.... okay, maybe I'm just an idiot...

[grizz]

The artful dodger:

If this is the case then, rather than banning them, perhaps we should just ignore them.

If they follow the rules and log into the 'debunker' thread pinned in the debate forum, they can avoid banning. But this is primarily a research forum, not a debate forum, and the staff has decided to take a course that involves wasting as little time on them as possible.

We've got a lot to do besides babysit and go over the same BS again and again. Most people come here to learn and share. We really are for sincere truthseekers. The liars can go somewhere else.

It's kind of like letting people who sh*t on your furniture come into your house. Once or twice and you make them stay outside, right?

[Sanders]

It's kind of like letting people who sh*t on your furniture come into your house. Once or twice and you make them stay outside, right?

(IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Wibble, are you Nicepants?? Hey, dude! I hope you've grown a sense of humor - and/or checked again and watched the towers fall at free-fall speed and thought, hey, wait a minute!?? ... or checked out that BBC report - of the collapse of WTC7 ... 20 minutes too early!!!! With the NY correspndent discussing the strange collapse of the Solomon Bros. building which hadn't been hit by a plane - while the building is still standing behind her in frame! Wahhhhahaha! - But I do hope you've been checking out all of the endless bizarre unexplainable anomolies that we've all looked at and thought, mmmm. But of course, there is the distinct possibility that you're not interested in any of that. (Not your job)

(IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[The artful dodge...]

Oceans

"It's kind of like letting people who sh*t on your furniture come into your house. Once or twice and you make them stay outside, right?"

Nah, you're right but I suspect they might be shown the door before they get their pants down the first time. I can't disagree with your statement at all, I just hate the way that these people say debate is being stifled when they get removed.

Edited because the damned quote thingy didn't work!!

This post has been edited by The artful dodger: Jun 27 2008, 04:24 AM