Alternative Fuels, Not those zero point energy scams Options

[Timothy Osman]

I think there is one thing everyone here can agree on, regardless of whether they believe we are about to run out of oil pretty soon or that artificial scarcities are used to raise profits at a minimum and or fit into some Malthusian plot at the maximum.
We all know that our dependence on oil is being manipulated by the usual suspects so rather than dwell on a negative like always I thought it would be a nice change to look to the future of real energy sources, not stinking oil or crap that relies on mystical waves from another dimension or magical magnets that summon their own energy from the center of the universe.

One I heard of recently is the Hydrazine fuel cell being developed by Daihatsu which eliminates the need for expensive Platinum as a catalyst.

http://techon.nikkeibp.co.jp/english/NEWS_...0070918/139286/

[lunk]

They have these motor-in-hub electric bicycle wheels.

Four make a car.

imo, lunk

[dMz]

... not stinking oil or crap that relies on mystical waves from another dimension or magical magnets that summon their own energy from the center of the universe.

I'm sorry but frankly that sounds a little "flat Earth" to me TO. I haven't seen a proper explanation of magnetism yet, or a proper definition for electric charge for that matter (I started a thread near here for that). Why is it that permanent magnets are perfectly acceptable in the 12 VDC starter motor or alternator in one's automobile, but they are verboten/taboo in the US Patent Office and "mainstream" "science"?

Testatika
http://www.rexresearch.com/testatik/testart.htm

N-machine
http://www.rexresearch.com/depalma/depalma.htm

I've observed a Bedini motor run firsthand, and I've seen "crap" in a cattle feedlot before- I can assure you that they have nothing in common:
http://www.icehouse.net/john34/bedinibearden.html

Crappy audio in this video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g9ARja0DiT0

I've run across maybe a dozen people in my lifetime that I could even discuss quaternion electrodynamics with, and 3 of them are now dead. Fortunately, there appear to be 3 of us or so on this forum. Lt. Col. Thomas Bearden is in his 80s now IIRC, and I haven't met him firsthand yet.

http://www.cheniere.org/

Oh well- "move along- there's nothing to see here." (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

An artist that I know (not painter) had an excellent quote: "Well sh*t, let's kill the goose since it doesn't lay golden eggs ON CUE (as opposed to doing more research)."

Proof by lack of observation or proof by ignorance don't really constitute proof proper, do they?
[/soapbox]

Back to more "mainstream" science- why aren't we generating electricity from the sewage that urban centers generate?

http://www.engr.psu.edu/ce/enve/mfc-Logan_...s/mfc-Logan.htm

Here's a link on butanol, thanks to lunk:
http://www.butanol.com/

Or methane from the garbage that urban centers generate?

http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn7048

http://www.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/me...edigestion3.htm

Or tap the thermal and mechanical energy in the world's oceans and lakes?

Or solar Stirling engines?
http://www.sandia.gov/news/resources/relea...t/Stirling.html

http://www.bekkoame.ne.jp/~khirata/academi...olar/index.html

http://www.stirlingengines.org.uk/sun/sun.html

http://www.stirlingenergy.com/

Or...

I really like this thread idea BTW. (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

This post has been edited by dMole: May 30 2008, 06:50 AM

[dMz]

They have these motor-in-hub electric bicycle wheels.

Four make a car.

imo, lunk

http://www.teslamotors.com/

imo, d

[lunk]

In North America every car has a lead-acid battery in it.
They are heavy to tote around.
Nickel-cadmium would be just as powerful and much lighter.
Though, the zinc-air battery might be better, environmentally.

I tried a power assist electric bicycle the other day (lead-acid)
It rode up a steep hill just like it was on the flat.

This is probably the cheapest alternate
powered form of transportation.

imo, lunk

[Timothy Osman]

I'm sorry but frankly that sounds a little "flat Earth" to me TO

Yeah I'm becoming a grumpy old bugger, I have never really been into the 'unknown' and that's my point. It isn't necessary to delve into the weird and wonderful regarding energy to figure out that our dependence on that filthy black crap the cartels control is no accident and that it is pretty easy to stay within the bounds of Newtonian science to make something rotate.
Having said that I'm prepared to be shocked. (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[dMz]

Yeah I'm becoming a grumpy old bugger, I have never really been into the 'unknown' and that's my point. It isn't necessary to delve into the weird and wonderful regarding energy to figure out that our dependence on that filthy black crap the cartels control is no accident and that it is pretty easy to stay within the bounds of Newtonian science to make something rotate.
Having said that I'm prepared to be shocked. (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

OK, TO

I might just get this thread moved now but here goes:

First a little about Stan Deyo (whose bio reads a bit like mine BTW, FWIW):

http://standeyo.com/bio.html

Now some videos from Stan:

Part 1 of 4
http://www.livevideo.com/video/AFBF864493A...ity-and-fr.aspx

Part 2
http://www.livevideo.com/video/26E6B2E6F76...ity-and-fr.aspx

Part 3
http://www.livevideo.com/video/C30DCD54DCB...ity-and-fr.aspx

Part 4 of 4
http://www.livevideo.com/video/3662C782193...ity-and-fr.aspx

Also, I've got plenty of links to bring things more "back down to earth" if that's too much for you. (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

I prefer the term "electrogravity" and you may want to review my post(s) here, too:
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10742684

http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....showtopic=13044

For some "evidence" and some excellent "alternate energy" links you might also try:

HV EG Lifters
http://jnaudin.free.fr/lifters/main.htm

http://bingofuel.online.fr/bingofuel/index.htm

I've also been in touch with a few researchers "down under," but I'd rather not post their info publicly for privacy and safety reasons. Lunk has got a pretty good idea of what those guys in Oz have been up to, I believe.

Check out this page too:
http://tesladownunder.com/

Oh yeah, back to the OP, hydrazine is some pretty nasty stuff if you're a fire or a biological organism:

http://www.sciencelab.com/xMSDS-Hydrazine-9924279

[bill]

Here is a link to a google vid for Stan Deyo

(that liveleak didn't work for me )


http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8...fnrCA&hl=en

[bill]

WOW !

Hot Videos

Front page !, our old friend Lindsey Williams on the Oil NON-Crisis

"There is enough crude oil on the north slope of Alaska to power the US for the next 200 years"

http://video.google.com/


This may huge


get out the ptchforks and torches

[lunk]

WOW !

Hot Videos

Front page !, our old friend Lindsey Williams on the Oil NON-Crisis

"There is enough crude oil on the north slope of Alaska to power the US for the next 200 years"

http://video.google.com/

get out the ptchforks and torches

"This video is no longer available"

Supply and demand pitchforks and torches.

imo, lunk

[Timothy Osman]

I think Stan Deyo is interesting insofar as he believed way back in 1977 that the ultimate goal of the masters of the universe was a one world government and that they were suppressing technical knowledge concerning energy. He loses me when he puts the cart before the horse with his Electric anti gravity devices. If you hook me up to mains power I'll defy gravity for a second or two myself, the same applies to bashing a coke bottle or snappin out a smoke ring with a rubber glove, he's putting in a hell of a lot of energy for his effects.
The problem as I see it is not that secret alien technologies are being suppressed but that "real" alternatives to the dumb old petrol engine have been suppressed. It's a no brainer to figure this out if you ever watch or drive a Semi Trailer down a hill in a low gear with all the anchors out with all the energy from momentum being wasted as heat instead of being converted to electricity, the suppression of electrically powered or even supplemented vehicle design is obvious.
There is a conspiracy here and I believe it's against electricity because it is potentially free. The rest looks like smoke and mirrors to me, even my rocket fuel cell. (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

[lunk]

This isn't alternate energy, but it is a very frictionless bearing:

http://magnetnerd.com/Neodymium%20Magnets/..._levitation.htm

[dMz]

He loses me when he puts the cart before the horse with his Electric anti gravity devices.

Electrogravity is NOT fiction, and it is NOT new. I'll wager that you did NOT research the links provided above TO. Where's painter with his "how to read" when I need him?

http://www.qualight.com/general/patents.htm

http://www.vreh.com/gravity/equation.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Townsend_Brown

http://www.rexresearch.com/1index.htm#scitech

The problem as I see it is not that secret alien technologies are being suppressed but that "real" alternatives to the dumb old petrol engine have been suppressed. It's a no brainer to figure this out if you ever watch or drive a Semi Trailer down a hill in a low gear with all the anchors out with all the energy from momentum being wasted as heat instead of being converted to electricity, the suppression of electrically powered or even supplemented vehicle design is obvious.
There is a conspiracy here and I believe it's against electricity because it is potentially free. The rest looks like smoke and mirrors to me, even my rocket fuel cell. (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

Is it possible that TO is still looking through the "polarized" "hall of mirrors" instead of over/around it?

The Teslamotors electric car that I linked above DOES use regenerative braking (which boosts it to the 92-97% efficiency range IIRC).

On fuel cells, a few books that I've got (those don't include my DoE library either, and be sure to check the dates):

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1592482422

http://www.eere.energy.gov/hydrogenandfuel...ate=sBookTopic1

[Bent Sorenson's book is highly technical BTW]
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0126552819

http://www.amazon.com/Fuel-Water-Energy-In...d_sim_b_title_4

http://www.amazon.com/Powering-Future-Ball...0233&sr=1-1

http://www.hydrogentruth.info/

http://h2-pv.us/H2/PDFs_Dloaded.html

I can lead them to the info, but I cannot make them think... (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/whistle.gif) (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

[dMz]

Yeah I'm becoming a grumpy old bugger, I have never really been into the 'unknown' and that's my point. It isn't necessary to delve into the weird and wonderful regarding energy to figure out that our dependence on that filthy black crap the cartels control is no accident and that it is pretty easy to stay within the bounds of Newtonian science to make something rotate.
Having said that I'm prepared to be shocked. (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

Hi TO and,

BTW, according to [pre-Michael Faraday] "Newtonian" science, your DC starter motor, alternator, power seat/lock/window motors, etc. in your automobile, and the 50 or 60 Hz generator that makes the electricity that your computer is using right now DO NOT WORK (or the computer for that matter).

[dMz]

OK, here's a more "down to earth" resource. Of course both the oil companies and "green" "debunkers" have been quick to dismiss it for years. There are many free books and .PDFs available on this page's links.

http://clean-air.org/

[lunk]

Of course both the oil companies and "green" "debunkers" have been quick to dismiss it for years.

http://clean-air.org/

Nothing I read here makes any sense to me
from the cold hard facts that I have unearthed.

It's like saying the holes make worms,
rather than, the worms make holes.

My clean air contains carbon dioxide.

Neither green and leafy or slick and oily.

imo, lunk

[dMz]

[A sub-thread split from:
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....showtopic=13762 ]

Here's another use for aluminum that damn few are likely to know: hydrogen production from water (the Cornish Patent).

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/4702894.html

http://keelynet.com/energy/cornish.htm

Note how Purdue is now (Feb. 20, 2008) claiming a "new invention" to produce hydrogen (20 years after Cornish's Oct. 27, 1987 patent).
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/...80219133226.htm

All the lies that are "printed to fit," even at a science/research publication...

Has anybody got any solid platinum wire just laying around that they can donate to a good cause? wink.gif

EDIT: The European/World patent goes back to 1982 apparently.
"30 June 1982 European patent Publication N° 0055134A1 allowing a car effectively running on water and little aluminum ..." BMW was aware of this and duplicated the system back in Nov 1981, based upon their letter at the above link.

[dMz]

Split thread from:
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....showtopic=13762

now, dmole....

pt is an interesting element. it is perhaps the most catalytically reactive element that i have sometimes used in my manufacturing operations. and it is a major player in the thermal pairs that we use in our high-temp measuring thermocouples.

in the presence of methane, when hot, it will initiate catalytic ignition.

and as i am sure you are aware, the refining, petrochemical industries are undoubtedly the largest users of pt as catalysts for their processing of hydrocarbons.

for your experiment, how much pt would you be wanting? and in what form? wire? plate?

i am pretty certain that i have some scrap 100% pt square wire[.040 x .040] hanging around in my vaults. and i am equally certain that i have similarly dimensioned 90pt10ir.

this is very expensive material today. a very small amount i might be willing to contribute.

even though i think your experiment to be quite unnecessary.

which leads me to a consideration of fuel cells. and the hydrogen economy. what a notion of passed methane.

Yes Albert, Pt brings a whole lot of catalysis to the party (with my emphasis on the lysis part). It is also used in the aerospace industry to initiate hydrazine propulsion "non-combustions" or decompositions in the absence of oxygen.

I was closer to joking about the Pt- no one gives away platinum in this economy do they? Either wire or plate would be great (especially 1/8" plate and up (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) ). I didn't think that anyone would consider parting with such valuable stuff. That is really the only inherent value that I place on precious metals- their chemical utility (Ag has some interesting chemical properties, and Au is great for plating marine conductors with but that's about all IMHO ). I suspect that the US Navy has a considerable collection of Pt as well, both on operating subs and at the NRL.

I was planning on winding some coils in different configurations (somewhat like the tungsten filament in a light bulb), so round wire would probably be the best to work with. Square conductors might give off some strange localized EM field effects (although that might actually be a good thing too- experimentation would tell).

Why exactly is it that "hydrogen economy" is one of those "lego phrases" (exactly like "conspiracy theory")? I see it used extensively by both Al Gore's "green" (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) circle and ExxonMobil-funded shills alike... In the early 20th century, there was a fully-operational "economy of hydrogen" for the dirigible/zeppelin industry [yes, I know "Hindenberg"- but that isn't quite as simple there as most people think]. There were also "economies of coal (producer, town) gas and water gas" in the 19th and early 20th centuries to provide heat, light, and energy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Town_gas

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_gas

We really ought to be re-thinking "heavier than air" aircraft for passenger transport in the current time IMHO.

Exactly what has changed between then and now that makes the "old chemistry" no longer economically viable? The answer to this question is not in the technology aspects IMHO. Carbon monoxide (CO) is excellent fuel for heating and for internal combustion engines (ICEs), especially when mixed with hydrogen gas BTW- see gasification.
--------------
[EDIT: Gasification infomation at post #85 at:
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....&p=10736130

also:
http://www.green-trust.org/woodgas.htm

Until you have actually run a gasifier firsthand, you likely won't "get" the combustion difference.]
---------------

I'm not really interested in "fixing" any economies in the near future- they will need to fix themselves, I'm afraid. I and several others worldwide that I'm in touch with have found some interesting results though.

I'm glad that you caused me to post this Albert. My recent computer crash had nearly lost 1.5 Gigabytes of my research on just hydrogen and water/ice (of 5 Gigabytes on alternate energy, not counting my video DVDs and reference CDs). I was really starting to suspect a "black bag" operation on my last computer until I finally located my data early this morning.

I can post a list of hydrogen patent numbers sometime in the future- I'm updating my reference spreadsheet now that I've reacquired my research. The dates on those hydrogen patents can be quite surprising to some...

Here's a thread to contemplate until then:

http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum//index....showtopic=13460

Also I find it strange that two of the better IMHO alternate energy websites that I have been referring people to have now been "sanitized." I have confirmation that another alt. energy website is just recently a "limited hangout" that is being used to target researchers for threats and intimidation (decades-old suppression tactics).

Now "Go Daddy sanitized" pages:
http://www.theverylastpageoftheinternet.com/

http://hydrogentruth.info/

[Of course, I have previously archived the hydrogentruth information- now I've just got to organize it all and upload it somewhere]

[dMz]

I couldn't get the text to copy in this extremely rare .PDF of a memo from the US Patent Office. I'll have to post some screen capture images here I suppose. Here is the .PDF in question- very interesting reading. Pay particular attention to the list in Part B.

We see the possibilities of "science" being pre-determined and specially handled by the US Patent Office. Many don't know that all patents are subject to US DoD review before a patent examiner ever sees them, and many patents have been "classified" and presumably locked away in those vaults of MD, VA, and DC.

Here's that Mar. 27, 2006 memo:
http://www.orbitfiles.com/download/id3071629862.html

This patent suppression has been going on considerably before 2007 however.

[dMz]

Much like the Cheney and now Bush impeachment filings, your worthless Senators heard about this issue back on Oct. 18, 2000.

http://epw.senate.gov/107th/loder.htm

More on/from Dr. Ted Loder:
http://users.erols.com/iri/Loder.PDF

http://www.aero2012.com/en/outsidethebox.mhtml