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Which Wake-vortex Is This - Port Or Starboard?, please help!

brokensticks
post Sep 17 2009, 12:36 AM
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As i recently mailed to rob, i need your help regarding what i thought showed the starboard wake vortex at the WTC:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PEOo22hBuec

someone on our forum reckons its the PORT-side wake vortex making those spirals.
its really frustrating me because the direction of rotation would make me think it was indeed a port-side vortex, but all the smoke comes out below the starboard vortex.

My thinking was that not enough smoke comes out from beneath the port-side wingtip for it to be the port-vortex. But now i can't explain the rotation of the spiral, which i could (in my head) when i thought it was the starboard vortex.


PLEASE, someone help me! I'm at the end of my tether with this!
Which is it, and where have i gone wrong?

Thank you in advance - any advice or help gladly received!
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rob balsamo
post Sep 17 2009, 01:50 AM
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Hello brokensticks.

First let me say i never received any email from you. And as most will attest... i usually reply the same day on an email. I will also add that i have blocked many on a spam group email recently. I also notified all that if you wish to contact us, to use our new contact form linked left margin of our home page. If you used a direct email and you perhaps were blocked as described (i didnt reply in a day or two), you should have used the contact form as advised.

Next...

My opinion? (since you asked)....



1. The above picture is at a slower speed and clean (as you correctly point out, HEAVY, CLEAN and SLOW creates the most vortex... its been in the AIM since day one), than the aircraft which reportedly attacked the WTC or.... Tower 2.

2. Your vertical column of rotating air looks nothing like the above picture provided. Furthermore your vortex is almost the width of the South Tower, ignoring your vortex measurement sources you provided.

3. Your Pentagon analysis is more interesting, however, as you correctly point out, the video has been manipulated.

My conclusion?

(in your native tongue if i may...)

Rubbish for your WTC analysis, inconclusive for Pentagon.

Welcome to the forum!

smile.gif
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Omega892R09
post Sep 17 2009, 07:01 AM
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QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Sep 15 2009, 04:50 AM) *
...(as you correctly point out, HEAVY, CLEAN and SLOW creates the most vortex...

As seen here with a Phantom F4K taken from the deck of Ark Royal near Malta in October 1970:



Flaps at near half (looks like they are on their way up), tell that it is a SLOWish pull up despite the fires burning.

This post has been edited by Omega892R09: Sep 17 2009, 11:57 AM
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brokensticks
post Sep 17 2009, 07:50 AM
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hi, thanks for the reply!

couple of questions:

do you think we see ANY signs of a wing vortex affecting the smoke at the WTC?

do you think we should see any signs of this?

i agree that my smoke column doesn't look like the picture, but i thought it was the effect of the vortex on the rising hot smoke that caused the WTC spiral. i honestly don't mind being wrong though - i'd just to like to find out for definite.


thanks again for answering - i definitely am NOT part of any email group that could have been blocked!
i sent the email to you just before i wrote this thread, and i sent it to an email address you mailed me from on the 9th. i'm sorry if i shouldn't be sending queries to you via email, and honestly, i never knew about the contact form you mentioned (the only email i received from you was in response to my question about the new presentation - i sent it from my davidjowen at live.co.uk address after i heard the Meria Heller interview).


thanks again, and if anyone knows for definite, i'd really appreciate an answer on these two questions:

do you think we see ANY signs of a wing vortex affecting the smoke at the WTC?

do you think we should see any signs of this?

because if not, i need to change my video! smile.gif

dave

This post has been edited by brokensticks: Sep 17 2009, 08:02 AM
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brokensticks
post Sep 19 2009, 08:45 AM
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QUOTE (brokensticks @ Sep 17 2009, 12:50 PM) *
couple of questions:

do you think we see ANY signs of a wing vortex affecting the smoke at the WTC?

do you think we should see any signs of this?

i agree that my smoke column doesn't look like the picture, but i thought it was the effect of the vortex on the rising hot smoke that caused the WTC spiral. i honestly don't mind being wrong though - i'd just to like to find out for definite.


anyone?

i've sent these questions to various scholars for their opinion (together with a short clip of the smoke spirals seen after "flight 175" hits). no answers yet.
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