Roosevelt Roberts Interview, Is this turn possible? Options

[chris sarns]

It's easier to put the disjointed pieces together by reading the transcript. Leaving out all the um's and searching for the right words, it breaks down like this:

Roosevelt:
coming from the 27 side heading east towards DC . . . it looked like it went over on the mall entrance side and turned around . . . . the plane . . . was facing west, so it went. . . southwest away from the Pentagon. . . around the lane one area, and it was like banking just above the light poles like. It was heading . . .back across 27. . . and it looks like . . . that plane was heading . . . southwest.

http://www.atsadgrab.com/forum/thread382628/pg1

The purple-ish path is what Roosevelt surmised from what he saw - the plane flying away to the south-west.
The red path combines what the north path witnesses saw and what Roosevelt saw.
The radius is about 330 feet. (?)

It's unlikely that Hani chickened out at the last second so let's assume somebody in the E4B was "flying" the 757 [or 737]. Assuming no pilot, can a 757 or 737 handle the g-forces to make that turn at a speed sufficient to stay in the air while making that turn?

(IMG:http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/8973/rrflightpaths80.jpg)

This post has been edited by chris sarns: Nov 4 2009, 10:30 AM

[rob balsamo]

Landmarks trump cardinal direction every time when dealing with witnesses, or even pilots, especially in an informal setting. I cant count how many times i have heard other pilots/ATC.. .etc... say southwest when they meant southeast. Northwest when they meant northeast... ."Traffic 9 O'clock" when they meant "3 o'clock"... and so on... Its an honest mistake.

Ever gotten directions from a friend? Ever heard them say "turn left" when they meant right? Or, "We are on the east side of the highway", when they really are on the west side?

To take Roberts statement of "southwest" in an interview on a cell phone while he was driving as literal.. while ignoring his landmark statements is intellectually dishonest or cherry picking to fit an already established belief/agenda.

A plane on the north path could not turn and head south-west as he stated.

Sure "a plane" can. It depends on the type aircraft and perhaps any classified military technology involved.

Again,

...if you accept the north flight path statements, any type of aircraft could have been used, including classified military technology, leaving the possibilities numerous, perhaps endless, and therefore speculation. The North approach is not limited to 757 (or 737) performance as required for the south path.

(i bolded it this time as it appears you missed it the first time and in the video...)

Since Roberts refused a second meeting to clarify statements, his most important statement at this time is the fact he vividly remembers observing an aircraft immediately AFTER the explosion. This is fatal to the govt story. Some CIT detractors feel we should ignore this altogether. I understand why they feel that way. Unfortunately for the detractors, "Nothing to see here folks, move along" doesnt sit well with real truth seekers.

[chris sarns]

Landmarks trump cardinal direction every time when dealing with witnesses, or even pilots, especially in an informal setting. I cant count how many times i have heard other pilots/ATC.. .etc... say southwest when they meant southeast. Northwest when they meant northeast... ."Traffic 9 O'clock" when they meant "3 o'clock"... and so on... Its an honest mistake.

To take Roberts statement of "southwest" in an interview on a cell phone while he was driving as literal.

He said he was in the south parking lot. He knew which direction south was. He knew Highway 27 was to the west.

while ignoring his landmark statements is intellectually dishonest or cherry picking to fit an already established belief/agenda.

I didn't expect that from you.


A plane on the north path could not turn and head south-west as he stated.

Sure "a plane" can. It depends on the type aircraft and perhaps any classified military technology involved.

Not the plane the north path witnesses described.

if you accept the north flight path statements, any type of aircraft could have been used,

Terry Morin said it was a 737 and later said it must have been a 757. There's not much difference.
(IMG:http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/7034/757737sm.jpg)
A 737-900 is only 17 feet shorter than a 757-200. The wingspan of a 373 is 12 feet less than a 757. The fuselage width is 12 feet for both.

Since Roberts refused a second meeting to clarify statements, his most important statement at this time is the fact he vividly remembers observing an aircraft immediately AFTER the explosion. This is fatal to the govt story.

He reaffirmed 10 seconds.

Aldo: A- okay. So- an- an- but- would- now how long would- I mean would you be sure that it was about ten seconds that it would take you to run from the phone to the outside, or would you think it was less than ten se- ten seconds?

Craig: Or a little bit more?

Roosevelt: It would've t- it would've taken about ten seconds, because after impact I stepped out the little, uh, booth that I was in. And the distance between. . . that booth and the edge of that dock is about, maybe, I don't know like. . . seven steps away from there.

This is your witness so if you don't believe him then how can you say he proves or even supports flyover?

[Aldo Marquis CIT]

He said he was in the south parking lot. He knew which direction south was. He knew Highway 27 was to the west.

He knew where south parking is because they have lots of signs telling you so.

I didn't expect that from you.


A plane on the north path could not turn and head south-west as he stated.

Actually a plane can. But that is not what he describes he describes it doing a u-turn out and heading to the Mall Entrance side.

Not the plane the north path witnesses described.

Actually yes it can.

Terry Morin said it was a 737 and later said it must have been a 757. There's not much difference.
(IMG:http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/7034/757737sm.jpg)
A 737-900 is only 17 feet shorter than a 757-200. The wingspan of a 373 is 12 feet less than a 757. The fuselage width is 12 feet for both.

Yeah it could have been a 737. So? Doesn't change that it could not and did not hit.

He reaffirmed 10 seconds.

Aldo: A- okay. So- an- an- but- would- now how long would- I mean would you be sure that it was about ten seconds that it would take you to run from the phone to the outside, or would you think it was less than ten se- ten seconds?

Craig: Or a little bit more?

Roosevelt: It would've t- it would've taken about ten seconds, because after impact I stepped out the little, uh, booth that I was in. And the distance between. . . that booth and the edge of that dock is about, maybe, I don't know like. . . seven steps away from there.

So? He also said 10 seconds tops. So it could be 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, or 9 seconds. For all you know, they could have been setting off the internal bombs before the plane even reached the building, prompting Roosevelt to run out and see the plane at what he thought was close to 10 seconds. A 7 steps to the edge of the loading dock, that is a clear indicator that it can only be the flyover plane he saw.

This is your witness so if you don't believe him then how can you say he proves or even supports flyover?

Dude listen to you. You sound like those scumbag "skeptics" who have ran out of fuel so they try some bizarre reverse psychology by trying to insinuate we "don't believe" our witnesses.

You lost, Chris. Go home. Stop being a spoiled sport.