Another Question For Warren Stutt, concerning altitude |

Dec 3 2009, 02:16 AM
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#1
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Group: Contributor Posts: 1,072 Joined: 15-October 06 Member No.: 75 |
Warren Stutt,
You must be aware that people are referencing you to suggest that your findings contradict the statements by P4T that the last reported altitude in the NTSB data shows a value too high to hit the light poles and the building. Are you willing to set the record straight here and at j.ref by publicly agreeing that your findings in the data concerning altitude CONFIRM the findings of P4T that it shows the plane too high to hit the light poles and the building? |
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Dec 3 2009, 02:35 AM
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#2
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∞* M E R C U R I A L *∞ Group: Valued Member Posts: 5,870 Joined: 25-August 06 From: SFO Member No.: 16 |
I would also like to hear Mr. Sutt's answer to this question but I might put it differently: Do you feel qualified to answer the question Craig is asking?
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Dec 3 2009, 09:59 AM
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#3
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Group: Troll Posts: 255 Joined: 27-December 07 From: Brisbane, Australia Member No.: 2,603 |
I would also like to hear Mr. Sutt's answer to this question but I might put it differently: Do you feel qualified to answer the question Craig is asking? Hi All,The question as expressed by painter is important. What I am quite certain about is that the last recorded ALTITUDE (1013.25mB) (FEET) in the FDR file I have been given is -99 feet (note the minus sign). I appreciate that this figure has to be adjusted to obtain the true altitude, but this adjustment is not something I feel qualified to do. I realise that Rob has used an online calculator to show that the true altitude is too high to hit the Pentagon, however I have seen arguments on J.R.E.F. saying that the pressure altitudes can not be relied upon since normally the aircraft would not be flying so fast, so low and the correct compensation has not been applied. The issue of how accurate the pressure altitude is has also been raised. Rob and the posters on J.R.E.F. are more qualified on this issue of adjustment than me, so I don't feel I can add anything useful. As far as Radio Height goes, the only required adjustment I am aware of is that the recorded value is above touchdown. Again I am quite certain that the last recorded RADIO HEIGHT is 4 feet, the question that Rob and the posters on J.R.E.F. differ on is what that is above. Is it the ground in front of the Pentagon, vegetation in front of the Pentagon or the top of the Pentagon? I know that I said that the question of whether AAL77 was too high to hit the light poles is what prompted me to do write my own decoder. The fact that both Rob and the posters on J.R.E.F. claim that the extra seconds of data I decoded supports their opposing views surprised me. This highlights how the same data can be interpreted differently. I did not fully appreciate this before. Warren. |
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Craig Ranke CIT Another Question For Warren Stutt Dec 3 2009, 02:16 AM
Craig Ranke CIT QUOTE (wstutt @ Dec 3 2009, 02:59 PM) I r... Dec 3 2009, 11:39 AM
trimble Very nice, Craig. Someone on the other thread tak... Dec 3 2009, 06:45 AM
rob balsamo If this value "cannot be relied on", why... Dec 3 2009, 12:19 PM
Craig Ranke CIT QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Dec 3 2009, 05:19 PM... Dec 3 2009, 01:10 PM
onesliceshort the govt loyalist site has not got ther facts stra... Dec 3 2009, 12:56 PM
Craig Ranke CIT QUOTE (onesliceshort @ Dec 3 2009, 05:56 ... Dec 3 2009, 01:04 PM
painter I just want to note that I'm very appreciative... Dec 3 2009, 04:09 PM
Craig Ranke CIT QUOTE (painter @ Dec 3 2009, 09:09 PM) I ... Dec 3 2009, 07:00 PM
onesliceshort I personally had been a lurker here for a long tim... Dec 3 2009, 11:10 PM
wstutt QUOTE (onesliceshort @ Dec 9 2009, 04:10 ... Dec 6 2009, 10:32 AM
rob balsamo QUOTE (wstutt @ Dec 6 2009, 09:32 AM) Her... Dec 6 2009, 12:09 PM
onesliceshort QUOTE (wstutt @ Dec 6 2009, 03:32 PM) I c... Dec 6 2009, 12:36 PM
wstutt Hi OSS,
QUOTE (onesliceshort @ Dec 11 2009, ... Dec 9 2009, 11:57 PM
onesliceshort QUOTE (wstutt @ Dec 10 2009, 04:57 AM) Hi... Dec 13 2009, 11:19 PM
wstutt Hi OSS,
QUOTE (onesliceshort @ Dec 19 2009, ... Dec 14 2009, 07:01 AM
rob balsamo Keep in mind folks, the descent rate from the top ... Dec 6 2009, 01:05 PM
wstutt Hi Rob,
QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Dec 11 2009, 06... Dec 10 2009, 12:02 AM
tnemelckram QUOTE The official data from the FDR makes the des... Dec 6 2009, 01:37 PM
onesliceshort QUOTE In other words, a stupid question deserves a... Dec 6 2009, 08:00 PM
rob balsamo Thanks Warren, but I was basing it on an initial v... Dec 13 2009, 05:04 PM
wstutt Hi Rob,
QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Dec 18 2009, 09... Dec 13 2009, 08:15 PM
JFK QUOTE (wstutt @ Dec 13 2009, 07:15 PM) I... Dec 13 2009, 10:01 PM
onesliceshort Hi Warren,
Yes I saw that IF there were indeed 4 s... Dec 14 2009, 05:36 PM
wstutt Hi Rob,
What do you think of the following claim:... Dec 20 2009, 09:19 AM
rob balsamo QUOTE (wstutt @ Dec 20 2009, 08:19 AM) Hi... Dec 21 2009, 01:33 AM
wstutt Hi Rob,
QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Dec 26 2009, 06... Dec 21 2009, 06:34 AM
rob balsamo Hi Warren,
The limitations which are publicly ava... Dec 21 2009, 11:40 AM
wstutt Hi Rob,
QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Dec 26 2009, 04... Dec 22 2009, 04:49 PM
rob balsamo QUOTE (wstutt @ Dec 22 2009, 03:49 PM) Hi... Dec 22 2009, 06:54 PM
wstutt Hi Rob,
QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Dec 27 2009, 11... Dec 26 2009, 01:48 AM
tnemelckram Hi Warren and Rob!
I posted my reading of the... Dec 22 2009, 06:56 PM
rob balsamo Warren, we're going in circles.... Please read... Dec 26 2009, 02:40 AM
Jefferson QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Dec 13 2009, 09:04 P... Dec 27 2009, 10:04 PM
rob balsamo QUOTE (Jefferson @ Dec 27 2009, 09:04 PM)... Dec 28 2009, 09:08 PM
Jefferson "Hi Jefferson,
The above calculations were d... Dec 28 2009, 11:44 PM
rob balsamo QUOTE (Jefferson @ Dec 28 2009, 10:44 PM)... Dec 29 2009, 12:12 AM
wstutt Hi Jefferson,
QUOTE (Jefferson @ Jan 3 2010,... Dec 31 2009, 09:11 PM
Jefferson I have a thought about altitude. It could be usefu... Dec 28 2009, 11:59 PM
Jefferson Thankyou rob balsamo. Sorry I think I am not being... Dec 29 2009, 12:33 AM
rob balsamo QUOTE (Jefferson @ Dec 28 2009, 11:33 PM)... Dec 29 2009, 12:48 AM
Jefferson "Yes. "
Thankyou rob balsamo, that was ... Dec 29 2009, 08:45 AM
wstutt Hi Rob,
Have you read post #4078 by apathoid on t... Jan 1 2010, 10:18 PM
rob balsamo QUOTE (wstutt @ Jan 1 2010, 09:18 PM) Hi ... Jan 1 2010, 10:30 PM
wstutt Hi Rob,
QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Jan 7 2010, 02... Jan 2 2010, 07:46 PM
JFK Here :
CODEhttp://www.abovetopsecret.com/for... Jan 2 2010, 08:03 PM
rob balsamo Hi Warren,
He made the statement at ATS Forum und... Jan 2 2010, 09:06 PM
wstutt Hi Rob,
I think Tom's point of uncertainty in... Jan 4 2010, 02:19 AM
rob balsamo Warren,
Tom and his minions are now trying to cla... Jan 4 2010, 02:36 AM
wstutt Hi Rob,
QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Jan 9 2010, 06... Jan 4 2010, 10:51 PM
dMole Off-topic meta-"chatter?" split here:
A... Jan 4 2010, 08:16 PM
rob balsamo Warren,
Not sure what you did with your calculat... Jan 4 2010, 11:08 PM
wstutt Hi Rob,
QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Jan 10 2010, 03... Jan 5 2010, 09:17 AM
rob balsamo Warren, since the numbers are so close for True He... Jan 5 2010, 09:34 AM
rob balsamo Here Warren,
This might lift some of the confusio... Jan 5 2010, 10:37 AM
wstutt Hi Rob,
QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Jan 10 2010, 02... Jan 6 2010, 05:00 AM
wstutt Hi Rob,
Where did you get the temperature and pre... Jan 6 2010, 01:24 AM
rob balsamo QUOTE (wstutt @ Jan 6 2010, 12:24 AM) Hi ... Jan 6 2010, 01:33 AM
rob balsamo Warren,
You calculated the margin for error in Gr... Jan 6 2010, 05:13 AM
JFK QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Jan 6 2010, 04:13 AM... Jan 6 2010, 11:03 AM

rob balsamo QUOTE (JFK @ Jan 6 2010, 10:03 AM) What I... Jan 6 2010, 02:29 PM
wstutt Hi Rob,
QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Jan 11 2010, 09... Jan 8 2010, 06:15 AM
JFK Appears being the key word.
I just tried cross re... Jan 6 2010, 04:11 PM
rob balsamo QUOTE (JFK @ Jan 6 2010, 03:11 PM) The we... Jan 6 2010, 04:21 PM

JFK QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Jan 6 2010, 03:21 PM... Jan 6 2010, 04:44 PM
wstutt Hi JFK,
QUOTE (JFK @ Jan 11 2010, 08:11 ... Jan 8 2010, 07:37 AM
JFK QUOTE (wstutt @ Jan 8 2010, 06:37 AM) Hi ... Jan 8 2010, 09:18 AM
wstutt Hi JFK,
QUOTE (JFK @ Jan 13 2010, 01:18 ... Jan 9 2010, 02:04 AM
JFK Just adding.... In the D226A101G.PDF the tolarance... Jan 6 2010, 04:37 PM
rob balsamo QUOTE (JFK @ Jan 6 2010, 03:37 PM) I did ... Jan 6 2010, 05:05 PM
JFK Yeah, I understand what it looks like and how it w... Jan 6 2010, 05:27 PM
rob balsamo QUOTE (JFK @ Jan 6 2010, 04:27 PM) Maybe ... Jan 6 2010, 05:36 PM
JFK Yeah, well normal cruise for a 757 is ~ +2.5°, so ... Jan 6 2010, 06:47 PM
rob balsamo QUOTE (JFK @ Jan 6 2010, 05:47 PM) Yeah, ... Jan 6 2010, 07:16 PM
JFK Well the limey's call it "normal cruise... Jan 6 2010, 07:56 PM
rob balsamo QUOTE (JFK @ Jan 6 2010, 06:56 PM) Well t... Jan 8 2010, 05:23 AM
tomk LMAO,
I figured you kids would find some way to... Jan 7 2010, 11:47 AM
JFK QUOTE (tomk @ Jan 7 2010, 10:47 AM) LMAO,... Jan 7 2010, 01:44 PM
alanj QUOTE (tomk @ Jan 8 2010, 03:47 AM) I fig... Jan 7 2010, 03:55 PM
rob balsamo Warren,
DCA weather values are not precise to the... Jan 8 2010, 08:40 AM
wstutt QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Jan 13 2010, 12:40 P... Jan 9 2010, 02:00 AM
rob balsamo QUOTE (wstutt @ Jan 9 2010, 01:00 AM) Can... Jan 9 2010, 02:38 AM

wstutt Hi Rob,
QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Jan 14 2010, 06... Jan 9 2010, 03:53 AM

rob balsamo QUOTE (wstutt @ Jan 9 2010, 02:53 AM) How... Jan 9 2010, 04:00 AM
rob balsamo With respect to +/-6 knots error allowed for TAS a... Jan 9 2010, 04:53 AM
JFK Sorry Rob, but this has to be said....
If that id... Jan 8 2010, 10:23 AM
rob balsamo QUOTE (JFK @ Jan 8 2010, 09:23 AM) Sorry ... Jan 8 2010, 10:41 AM
wstutt QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Jan 13 2010, 02:41 P... Jan 9 2010, 02:10 AM
JFK Yeah, well Craig and I have also gone head to head... Jan 8 2010, 11:09 AM
rob balsamo Fair enough.....and i agree. This is why i havent ... Jan 8 2010, 11:14 AM
JFK QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Jan 8 2010, 10:14 AM... Jan 8 2010, 11:47 AM
rob balsamo QUOTE (JFK @ Jan 8 2010, 10:47 AM) ..and ... Jan 8 2010, 11:54 AM
JFK From where I sit he appears to be concentrating on... Jan 8 2010, 12:06 PM
rob balsamo QUOTE (JFK @ Jan 8 2010, 11:06 AM) From w... Jan 8 2010, 12:16 PM
wstutt QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Jan 13 2010, 04:16 P... Jan 9 2010, 02:35 AM
Craig Ranke CIT QUOTE (wstutt @ Jan 9 2010, 07:35 AM) No ... Jan 9 2010, 12:14 PM
JFK As clear as the various DFL's.
- respectfully... Jan 8 2010, 12:57 PM
JFK In the meantime the old fucked up drunkard come al... Jan 9 2010, 12:08 AM
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