Disputes From The Cesspit, split from latest news Options

[robot]

Just thought you might like to know that the the govt loyalist site forum has spotted your post. Summary - this is old news. Threads were created long ago that discussed these issues.

You guys run out of new evidence and now dressing up old evidence as new?

govtloyalistsite.org/showthread.php?t=66047

Edit. Seems like this software has a sense of humour. It changed the URL.

[onesliceshort]

Just thought you might like to know that the the govt loyalist site forum has spotted your post. Summary - this is old news. Threads were created long ago that discussed these issues.

Yes, and judging by the total annihilation of one of Randi's "expert" posts in this thread, we know that what some label "old news" is usually information that has been been crapped on from a great height watched by nodding dogs. That's not "discussion", Robot, that's J.REF.

What I'd really like explained over there is how the co-ordinates at the gate can be claimed to have been "off"? As must have been the latitudinal coordinates leading from the gate? Then the longitudinal distance to the runway?

But then somehow aligns itself to line up an alleged 125ft wingspan aircraft perfectly within a 200ft wide runway for takeoff?

(IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/pics/INS_IAD_Adjust.jpg)

Blow, smoke and ass. Fill the blanks.

[rob balsamo]

What I'd really like explained over there is how the co-ordinates at the gate can be claimed to have been "off"? As must have been the latitudinal coordinates leading from the gate? Then the longitudinal distance to the runway?

But then somehow aligns itself to line up an alleged 125ft wingspan aircraft perfectly within a 200ft wide runway for takeoff?


Blow, smoke and ass. Fill the blanks.

The raw data is not aligned with anything, not the gate, nor the runway.

(IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/pics/INS_IAD.jpg)

As pointed out, repeatedly, Pilots align the IRS with the gate lat/long coordinates. The above IRS was not aligned prior to flight as required by American Airlines and seemed to have auto-aligned in flight. This is impossible for the IRS installed on American Airlines aircraft.


The data did not come from an American Airlines 757.

[mrmitosis]

Pilots align the IRS with the gate lat/long coordinates. The above IRS was not aligned prior to flight as required by American Airlines and seemed to have auto-aligned in flight. This is impossible for the IRS installed on American Airlines aircraft.

I'm sure this has been addressed many times...but if the IRS was not aligned before taking off, and then auto-aligned during flight, what implications does this have for the impact analyses done by Legge/Stutt and P4T? Is there general agreement at least on the issue of how the data needs to be calibrated to correct any initial errors in the co-ordinates? (Or does the raw data relating to the impact phase come from a different source? We're still talking about FDR data, right?)

And out of curiosity, what is it that indicates there was an auto-alignment mid-flight? I'm guessing it's a clue somewhere in the data file, but what?

Sorry for the dopey questions (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)

[rob balsamo]

I'm sure this has been addressed many times...but if the IRS was not aligned before taking off, and then auto-aligned during flight, what implications does this have for the impact analyses done by Legge/Stutt and P4T?

No real impact on the Legge/Stutt paper as it was garbage before and it remains garbage.

Not much impact on our analysis either. The data still does not support an impact, but now it also does not support a push from Gate D26, nor does it support the govt claims that the data came from an American Airlines 757.

Is there general agreement at least on the issue of how the data needs to be calibrated to correct any initial errors in the co-ordinates?

Legge/Stutt dont have a clue of anything related to aviation. They basically have very limited knowledge from what they have been told by others, then speculate the rest and spin it to their bias. An old saying in aviation, a little knowledge is more dangerous than none. Thank goodness neither of them fly an airplane. I dont think they will ever agree with the work we have done until they perhaps have decades of experience in aviation and understand the work.

And out of curiosity, what is it that indicates there was an auto-alignment mid-flight? I'm guessing it's a clue somewhere in the data file, but what?

Footnote 9
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=21149
(sorry, i know the above pic is a mess, it was done by Farmer. but you can see the white Lat/Long merge with Radar plots in flight. This is impossible for American Airlines 757's if it werent aligned at the gate.)

@OSS

This is the only thing they can do to fit their square peg into a round hole.
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/index.p...&p=10795507

That is why most if not all of their "retorts" to our latest analysis are all personal attacks, ad homs and libel. They have nothing left in their arsenal.

[mrmitosis]

No real impact on the Legge/Stutt paper as it was garbage before and it remains garbage.

Not much impact on our analysis either. The data still does not support an impact, but now it also does not support a push from Gate D26, nor does it support the govt claims that the data came from an American Airlines 757.

Legge/Stutt dont have a clue of anything related to aviation. They basically have very limited knowledge from what they have been told by others, then speculate the rest and spin it to their bias. An old saying in aviation, a little knowledge is more dangerous than none. Thank goodness neither of them fly an airplane. I dont think they will ever agree with the work we have done until they perhaps have decades of experience in aviation and understand the work.

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that I was under the impression that your analysis supported impact. I didn't fall asleep in class for THAT long (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/whistle.gif)

My question was related more to the way the co-ordinates needed to be adjusted to account for the 3000 foot offset, and whether P4T and Stutt/Legge had calculated for this in the same way. But I'm starting to realise this is a redundant question, if the GPS system made the adjustments automatically mid-flight....?

Just ignore me, I'm just thinking out loud (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/whistle.gif)

[rob balsamo]

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that I was under the impression that your analysis supported impact. I didn't fall asleep in class for THAT long (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/whistle.gif)

My question was related more to the way the co-ordinates needed to be adjusted to account for the 3000 foot offset, and whether P4T and Stutt/Legge had calculated for this in the same way. But I'm starting to realise this is a redundant question, if the GPS system made the adjustments automatically mid-flight....?

Just ignore me, I'm just thinking out loud (IMG:http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/style_emoticons/default/whistle.gif)

You're fine my friend... :-)

They are all good questions as others probably have the same questions and can read the answers here (although they are elsewhere, but kinda spread out).

There are many different possibilities. Many of which were explored in the "911gate" thread started by tume, with respect to how the error in data would impact the end of data near the Pentagon.

If the aircraft were aligned at the gate with such a large error (in other words, inputting a "Present Position" that was not actually your Present Position), the same error needs to be applied at the end of data because the IRS in the aircraft claimed (N644AA) does not have auto-align ability to adjust for the error made. If the same error is applied at the end of data as was seen at the gate, it will take the aircraft North Of Citgo. Drift is also an issue.

The aircraft does have an update ability, But "update" is different than an alignment. The initial alignment needs to be accurate in order for the rest of the data to be accurate. It is impossible to get an accurate position in flight if the initial alignment was in error (or not aligned), and the aircraft does not have in flight auto-align capability.

Since the data shows an auto-align after departure, merging with Radar plots, if all the data is authentic, it did not come from an American Airlines 757, as such aircraft do not have this capability.