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Gitmo Trials - The Real Reason

bobcat46
post Apr 5 2011, 09:28 AM
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Yesterday, Attorney General Holder announced that military trials will be conducted at Gitmo for the terrorists (primarily KSM) accused for 9/11. He also said that he knew more about the cases than anyone in Congress. Well, yes, he does know more and that is why the Obama Administration has not moved forward with the trials in NY using our civilian justice system. The Obama Administration knows the truth about 9/11 and have no intentions of allowing KSM the opportunity to move into disclosure in a public forum because the truth about 9/11 would be exposed. Having this trial in Gitmo under military justice (an oxymoron) is a slap in the face to our Constitution and, in my opinion, a huge setback in our quest to expose the truth about 9/11.

Shame on you, Obama and the people in your administration. You are continuing to sweep the truth under the carpet.


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DoYouEverWonder
post Apr 5 2011, 02:23 PM
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They know they can't get a conviction in an US Court.

That's why BushCo used torture. It was a way to destroy and hide the evidence by making sure there could never be a real trial.
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amazed!
post Apr 5 2011, 03:30 PM
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I agree 100% Bob. I was just thinking of this earlier today.

This is an admission that they do not have sufficient evidence to convict in a civil trial.

They are forced to try it in the corrupt military system.

Public is too fooking stoopid to even understand what is happening.
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IslandPilot
post Apr 5 2011, 05:30 PM
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The GITMO Gulag:
Bobcat said:
QUOTE
The Obama Administration knows the truth about 9/11 and have no intentions of allowing KSM the opportunity to move into disclosure in a public forum because the truth about 9/11 would be exposed. Having this trial in Gitmo under military justice (an oxymoron) is a slap in the face to our Constitution and, in my opinion, a huge setback in our quest to expose the truth about 9/11.

Shame on you, Obama and the people in your administration. You are continuing to sweep the truth under the carpet.

I agree with the GITMO "military justice oxymoron" comment wholeheartedly! thumbsup.gif
Then DYEW says:
QUOTE
They know they can't get a conviction in an US Court.
That's why BushCo used torture. It was a way to destroy and hide the evidence by making sure there could never be a real trial.

I tended to agree with the "BushCo torture" comment at first. I understand the "feeling" being expressed. But the reality is that there is there is no relationship between "torture" and "trials".

My "probem" with both of these posts is that you are "assuming" the "US Court system" is intact and "uncompromised"; and fully operational as set forth in the US Constitution; to be a "third" branch of Government... established in a system of "Checks and Balances"; opposing the "Legislative" and "Executive" branches, to LIMIT the POWER vested in any SINGLE branch.

The US Judicial System today, is only a "shell" of its former self. It has become the "Lap Dog" of the Executive branch, who also Shepard the "flocks" in the "House" and "Senate", in case you haven't noticed.

When the US Supreme Court "rules" that a "Corporation" is a "Person" to completely WIPE OUT any IDEA of "Campaign FINANCING, or ELECTION LAW Reforms"; it means our former "Government OF the People*, BY the People*, and FOR the People*, HAS PERISHED FROM THE FACE OF THE EARTH!
(*"People" = original meaning = human beings)
We now live under a "Government of Corporations"; (at least on the surface) whether we like it or not. The Executive Branch dances to the MIC Corporate "tune"; who finances their "elections". They have now Appointed enough "Compliant" people to the Judiciary, to control nearly every legal "decision".

The "Legislative Branch" of "Demicans" and "Republicats" is a complete joke. They don't "Legislate" a dam thing anymore. They don't even vote. They just "co-sign" Corporate supplied, 2000 page documents they've never read, into "LAW".

The ONLY PURPOSE of CONGRESS is to receive small Tokens of Taxpayer Wealth, distributed according to a member's "compliance" with the goals of the "Corporate PTB". If a congressman has "been good"; he'll return to his district with "Federal Grants" and "Earmarked Funds" for his best Campaign Contributors. A few new jobs are created.... and Everybody is "Happy".

Congressmen with "higher principles" and integrity; will just receive smaller "Tokens" of Taxpayer wealth. People will still be "Happy" back home; just a little less so... but, they'll have a chance to vote for a "better" (corporate compliant) candidate in the next election. Then guess, who is gonna win?

Getting back to GITMO: Our US CONGRESS has SAT ON ITS HANDS and HAS KNOWINGLY ALLOWED THEIR EXECUTIVE BRANCH to Detain, Relocate, and Torture HUMAN BEINGS, openly defying the US CONSTITUTION, several INTERNATIONAL LAWS, including the (unsigned?) Geneva Convention, and denying all basic "Human Rights", as well as access to "Justice" to individuals, without any "PROOF" that any detainee has EVER COMMITTED a CRIME! Only a KING or a DICTATOR, can have this kind of POWER! And Congress ALLOWS our President to HAVE and to USE, this kind of POWER??

The US CONGRESS is nothing but a useless WIMP to the US Military, and has SHIRKED its RESPONSIBILITY to provide any limiting "CHECKS or BALANCES" against the unlawful activity of the Executive Branch,... concerning the unprecedented "black ops prison camps like GITMO" and the TORTURE of "Detainees" and/or "Hostile Combatants" throughout the world.

Every Congressperson who hasn't taken action against the TORTURE of DETAINEES, or against the GITMO prison camp in general, should be arrested and brought to trial before an International Tribunal, for "Crimes Against Humanity"; as well as the "Presidental Perpetrators" of these terrible crimes IMO.

Every SINGLE person in the US Government who hasn't or "won't" TAKE IMMEDIATE ACTION to CLOSE the GITMO Prison Camp, is a DEVOUT COWARD, and should hang their heads in SHAME for every day it remains "OPEN FOR MORE TORTURE", because President KING OBAMA "says so"! worthy.gif
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IslandPilot
post Apr 5 2011, 06:28 PM
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QUOTE (amazed! @ Apr 5 2011, 02:30 PM) *
I agree 100% Bob. I was just thinking of this earlier today.

This is an admission that they do not have sufficient evidence to convict in a civil trial.

They are forced to try it in the corrupt military system.

Public is too fooking stoopid to even understand what is happening.

I do not necessarily "agree" with the following statement:
QUOTE
This is an admission that they do not have sufficient evidence to convict in a civil trial.

That statement is, in itself, quite true.

But the "problem" is in what you are calling "evidence"; and the "proof" necessary to win a conviction. The "next" US public trial, of someone connected to the 9/11 attacks; might not go as "well" as the "last one" against the "extra" 9/11 Islamic Terrorist, who didn't "hijack" an airplane.

As I remember it; he faced charges for multiple crimes; and was tried in New York City; which would be a pretty "hostile" venue, from which to assemble an "impartial" jury, IMO. He was acquitted on most of the charges and counts, and ended up being sentenced to "ONLY ONE LIFE TERM IN PRISON", instead of several. (Don't ask me what's the difference between ONE LIFE term or 20 LIFE TERMS; I don't understand...)

Some of the "Physical Evidence" presented at this trial included a few "airplane parts" presented in "Evidence" as "Proof" of the "Crime" that he alledgedly committed. Somehow these "airplane parts" were allowed to stand as "evidence" (or were not properly challenged) in this trial. The Prosecution made NO ATTEMPT to properly IDENTIFY these parts, or to provide a "Chain of Custody" to VERIFY that these alledged airplaned parts, were actually removed from a specific location within the WTC "Ground Zero" area... or to properly identify them in such a manner to prove they were once "Part of an actual AIRCRAFT" alledgedly USED in the 9/11 attacks at the WTC site.

They got "that" Conviction, without proper evidence, just barely... but it wasn't the OVERWHELMING decision they were hoping for, I'm sure of that. It's not impossible for them to get Convictions without proper evidence; but I would agree they don't want to take the "risk" of LOSING such a US Court trial in the future.

And the chance for "unknown" real EVIDENCE of Torture, or the "LACK" of real "verifiable" PHYSICAL EVIDENCE to ensure a Conviction; to come out in a PUBLIC TRIAL; attended by International News Media; would be just too RISKY for the GITMO Advocates.

Besides that; there's a "Precedent" to consider: Since when has a KING or DICTATOR allowed "ordinary citizens" to decide the fate its of "Enemies of the Crown" or the "Foes it has defeated in battle". Isn't this the "rule" they want to apply here?
as far as:
QUOTE
Public is too fooking stoopid to even understand what is happening.

I couldn't agree with you more! And they just keep getting stoopider and stoopider every day! salute.gif
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amazed!
post Apr 5 2011, 09:33 PM
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I'm with you IP. salute.gif

About all we can do is talk about it in public--make people talk about it. But you see an awful lot of anxious faces when you do that.

I do think people are becoming more aware, but it's like they are afraid to do anything about it. blink.gif
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IslandPilot
post Apr 5 2011, 09:56 PM
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"Templar Knights" and the Gulag system, and how it applies to GITMO.

At times, I will lurk in the "Research" forums, and browse through the "History and the Elite" and also the "Dragon Blood-line" threads, tended to mainly by elreb, quest, and Sanders.

Somehow, the information they have "gathered" about the "Templar Knights" seems to "fit" quite well into the 911 scenerio. I'm also familiar with most other alledged "powers behind Thrones" in NWO discussions. But the "Templar Knight" and "Battle of Hastings" participants "stick" with me the most.

As I was researching my "uncompleted" Korean Airlines 007 Shootdown thread; I "encountered" the Soviet "GULAG" system. I was Clueless, and thought of a Gulag, as a prison camp, where "dissidents" and others who "screwed up" were sent, basically to "Rot" and die. But, it has a more "sinister" purpose than that.

The most current evidence relating to KAL 007, indicates that most of the people on that B-747 survived a successful "ditching" into the water near Moneron Island. This conflicts with the "official story"; still in effect today, that everyone onboard perished from either the Soviet missile "explosion" or at "impact" after "plummeting" 35,000 ft into the water.

If the people lived, what happened to them? Long story short:
Congressman Larry MacDonald was transferred to a Moscow Prison for "Intensive Interrogations", for quite a while; after that he was sent to a remote Gulag.
The children were sent to Orphanages, where other children with similar ethnic backgrounds were present.
The rest of the passengers, and crewmembers were sent to remote GULAG Camps, (without even the thought of a trial) to spend the rest of their lives; working like slaves, at Hard Labor like logging, and mining, to the benefit of their captors. (one of the female 007 survivors, lost an arm in a logging accident; but had to return to work as soon as her wound healed.)

The "reasoning" for the GULAG system, and why the missing passengers were sent there goes like this. The "hapless surviving victims" of KAL OO7 were "enemies of the Soviet Union, "captured in Wartime" (during the "Cold War"), and as "such" they became the "property" of the Soviet Union to dispose of as they saw fit.

To "return" the survivors to their families would have been a big "Diplomatic" problem for both sides. The US would have had to "retract" the false claims made immediately after KAL 007 went missing; and they would have had to "explain" WHAT IT WAS DOING by being so far OFF COURSE, on purpose.
It was "best" for the US Government to just "forget" that those people ever existed.

The Soviet "mind set" when it came to being "Victorious in Battle against an enemy"; was to "celebrate their power" over this enemy, by enslaving him and putting him to good use by "serving" them. This "ruthlessness" toward losers in battle, didn't start in Russia, and hasn't ended anywhere else in the world, even today.

The "classic" example of this is provided by "Templar Knights"; the Vikings; and all other Pirates who "whip" their prisoners into submission", and make good "use" of them by tending the oars on their warships.

As I tried to consider what happened to the passengers on AA77, that DIDN'T crash into the Pentagon; I was "happy" to realize that we didn't have any "GULAGS" here in the United States, that I'm aware of (or still clueless about). My ignorant happiness lasted about a minute, when I realized that those people could have been taken "someplace like Guantanamo".

The "unbelievable horror" for the "true purpose of the GITMO Prison", will never leave me, until it is SHUT DOWN!

US Citizens would NEVER allow such a GULAG to exist within the United States (although I don't know what else you'd call the Japenese Internment Camps during WWII)! So why do our Citizens allow THEIR GOVERNMENT, to maintain GULAGS, like GITMO, outside the United States?

Although I don't believe any 911 airplane passengers or crewmembers wound up at Guantanamo, how would we know if they did? "Transparancy" of this Government? I don't think so.

And if DICTATOR OBAMA decides he "doesn't like" something I've written; I could be "stripped naked" and "getting waterboarded" in GITMO by this time tomorrow; just as well as YOU, or anyone else the "MAN" behind the Dictator Obama puppet "doesn't like".

THAT SCARES THE HELL OUT OF ME and it should scare the HELL out of EVERYBODY else.

I actually "voted" for that FOOOKER, because he "promised" to CLOSE GWB's GITMO Prison Camp, and put an END to the TORTURE. That SOB LIED to us.

And the "excuses" for NOT CLOSING IT are so GD LAME it isn't even FUNNY. Get this. Reason Numero Uno for NOT CLOSING GITMO is: MONEY! WTF??
"They" say we can't "afford" to reactivate, or rebuild a prison in Illinois to hold the GITMO prisoners.

What kind of a LIE is that? If you look at the "Consolidated Annual Financial Report" of any State, or Governmental entity having a Prison; you'll see its "Prison System" is one of its most PROFITABLE MONEY MAKING ENTERPRISES! DUH? How stooopid do they think us sheeple are?

My next question is just as Baa Baa Baaadd: How much does it cost for someone to make a meal for a prisoner near Chicago, Illinois... as compared to the cost of a prisoner meal in GITMO, supplied by a (Haliburton-esc) Subcontractor in that "remote" location? whistle.gif
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elreb
post Apr 5 2011, 10:20 PM
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QUOTE (IslandPilot @ Apr 5 2011, 03:56 PM) *
At times, I will lurk in the "Research" forums, and browse through the "History and the Elite" and also the "Dragon Blood-line" threads, tended to mainly by elreb, quest, and Sanders.


I also agree with you IslandPilot…

No sooner does the “bible” get started…you have murder and cover-up…for the sake of power & control.

History of the Dragon family and the Elite is nothing more than one war after another…

Nothing has changed…and sadly…we may have lost our 9 lives…
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Obwon
post Apr 6 2011, 09:23 AM
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Oh, I don't know so much about Obama being a dictator, or anything else beyond just another captive of the "system" public ignorance-as-bliss has allowed to be built. I can easily imagine him scanning the political landscape. What would he find there? Far too many people, pretty heavily invested in "what's happening now", to be very concerned about what may have happened some time ago. People just aren't as motivated about how lies corrupt the system they're working under, because they're more interested in safeguarding whatever gains they believe they've already made. It's "the devil you know" kinda thing".

A man tried to give the nation a clue about the sub-prime mortgage affair. Before he could speak he became "Client No. 9", where such a din rose up in the media, he couldn't get to the podium. If a President were to try to spring a surprise enlightening speech on the public, I do not doubt that a ruckus of some sort would initiate, forcing the SS to whisk him from the podium for reasons of security, in mid sentence.

Just look around at what's been corrupted/changed, to evaluate just how powerful are the traps that have, and are being laid. Nope, the "levers of power" remain in the same hands, even though the public players have changed. We're still captives of the men behind the curtain. They may have been significantly weakened in the last election, but they're quickly regaining their footing. So make no mistake, "the truth" will not set anyone free, unless it's part of a carefully orchestrated design. This is because "truth" is so easily made controversial today, among people unable to identify and/or discriminate between the truth and mere fiction. The people "behind the curtain" need to be unmasked one by each, in a continuous
process of weakening them and their ability to plan.

The "short game" is no longer viable. Depending on "the truth to out" to bring forth some sort of national or worldwide catharsis is false. Because it's like trying to slay the many headed hydra, the facts will be compromised, the players changed and the game carried on without hesitation. While identifying and compromising the top players, weakens their ability to plan and successfully execute. Without their best minds at work, the organization disintegrates. So that should be the effective goal.

Obwon

This post has been edited by Obwon: Apr 6 2011, 09:28 AM
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amazed!
post Apr 6 2011, 11:15 AM
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IP

Yes, it seems you are unaware of the American Gulag.

Keep in mind that the US has the highest per capita rate of imprisonment for decades running.

Back when the USSR existed, and before Apartheid was banished in South Africa, we used to share the number one spot in that category with those 2 regimes, alternating from year to year.

Now, the US is so far ahead of any other country that it's not even close.

Yes, the "political prisoner" thing might not apply quite so strongly to the American Gulag than to the Russian one, but that point could be argued. Consider Bradley Manning, surely a political prisoner.

I think the case could easily be made, as you have done, that Gitmo is nothing but political prisoners.
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elreb
post Apr 6 2011, 05:13 PM
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Wait a minute…

Someone said the other day that “National Aeronautics and Space Administration” [NASA] was nothing more than an excuse for Federal jobs…and a waste of good engineers…

Does that also mean that the Federal “Drug Enforcement Administration” (DEA) and the many prison systems holding Marijuana folks is a ruse to justify unnecessary jobs?
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amazed!
post Apr 6 2011, 09:28 PM
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That sure is a big part of it, Elreb.

If the drug prohibition did not exist, our prisons would only be half full.
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albertchampion
post Apr 6 2011, 10:41 PM
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it actually goes way beyond that. the prisons are filled mostly with young black men. it is a racist artefact.
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Lights
post Apr 6 2011, 11:54 PM
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QUOTE (DoYouEverWonder @ Apr 5 2011, 06:23 PM) *
They know they can't get a conviction in an US Court.

That's why BushCo used torture. It was a way to destroy and hide the evidence by making sure there could never be a real trial.


That's my take on it. If they took this thing to a civilian court it would probably be very quickly thrown out. If not the defendants would be acquitted. What a load of crap on the Feds' part.
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Lights
post Apr 6 2011, 11:55 PM
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QUOTE (elreb @ Apr 6 2011, 09:13 PM) *
Wait a minute…

Someone said the other day that “National Aeronautics and Space Administration” [NASA] was nothing more than an excuse for Federal jobs…and a waste of good engineers…

Does that also mean that the Federal “Drug Enforcement Administration” (DEA) and the many prison systems holding Marijuana folks is a ruse to justify unnecessary jobs?



Yep. Pretty much.
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Lights
post Apr 6 2011, 11:58 PM
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QUOTE (elreb @ Apr 6 2011, 09:13 PM) *
Wait a minute…

Someone said the other day that “National Aeronautics and Space Administration” [NASA] was nothing more than an excuse for Federal jobs…and a waste of good engineers…

Does that also mean that the Federal “Drug Enforcement Administration” (DEA) and the many prison systems holding Marijuana folks is a ruse to justify unnecessary jobs?

Yep. Pretty muchl
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Lights
post Apr 7 2011, 12:02 AM
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QUOTE (IslandPilot @ Apr 6 2011, 01:56 AM) *
"Templar Knights" and the Gulag system, and how it applies to GITMO.

At times, I will lurk in the "Research" forums, and browse through the "History and the Elite" and also the "Dragon Blood-line" threads, tended to mainly by elreb, quest, and Sanders.

Somehow, the information they have "gathered" about the "Templar Knights" seems to "fit" quite well into the 911 scenerio. I'm also familiar with most other alledged "powers behind Thrones" in NWO discussions. But the "Templar Knight" and "Battle of Hastings" participants "stick" with me the most.

As I was researching my "uncompleted" Korean Airlines 007 Shootdown thread; I "encountered" the Soviet "GULAG" system. I was Clueless, and thought of a Gulag, as a prison camp, where "dissidents" and others who "screwed up" were sent, basically to "Rot" and die. But, it has a more "sinister" purpose than that.

The most current evidence relating to KAL 007, indicates that most of the people on that B-747 survived a successful "ditching" into the water near Moneron Island. This conflicts with the "official story"; still in effect today, that everyone onboard perished from either the Soviet missile "explosion" or at "impact" after "plummeting" 35,000 ft into the water.

If the people lived, what happened to them? Long story short:
Congressman Larry MacDonald was transferred to a Moscow Prison for "Intensive Interrogations", for quite a while; after that he was sent to a remote Gulag.
The children were sent to Orphanages, where other children with similar ethnic backgrounds were present.
The rest of the passengers, and crewmembers were sent to remote GULAG Camps, (without even the thought of a trial) to spend the rest of their lives; working like slaves, at Hard Labor like logging, and mining, to the benefit of their captors. (one of the female 007 survivors, lost an arm in a logging accident; but had to return to work as soon as her wound healed.)

The "reasoning" for the GULAG system, and why the missing passengers were sent there goes like this. The "hapless surviving victims" of KAL OO7 were "enemies of the Soviet Union, "captured in Wartime" (during the "Cold War"), and as "such" they became the "property" of the Soviet Union to dispose of as they saw fit.

To "return" the survivors to their families would have been a big "Diplomatic" problem for both sides. The US would have had to "retract" the false claims made immediately after KAL 007 went missing; and they would have had to "explain" WHAT IT WAS DOING by being so far OFF COURSE, on purpose.
It was "best" for the US Government to just "forget" that those people ever existed.

The Soviet "mind set" when it came to being "Victorious in Battle against an enemy"; was to "celebrate their power" over this enemy, by enslaving him and putting him to good use by "serving" them. This "ruthlessness" toward losers in battle, didn't start in Russia, and hasn't ended anywhere else in the world, even today.

The "classic" example of this is provided by "Templar Knights"; the Vikings; and all other Pirates who "whip" their prisoners into submission", and make good "use" of them by tending the oars on their warships.

As I tried to consider what happened to the passengers on AA77, that DIDN'T crash into the Pentagon; I was "happy" to realize that we didn't have any "GULAGS" here in the United States, that I'm aware of (or still clueless about). My ignorant happiness lasted about a minute, when I realized that those people could have been taken "someplace like Guantanamo".

The "unbelievable horror" for the "true purpose of the GITMO Prison", will never leave me, until it is SHUT DOWN!

US Citizens would NEVER allow such a GULAG to exist within the United States (although I don't know what else you'd call the Japenese Internment Camps during WWII)! So why do our Citizens allow THEIR GOVERNMENT, to maintain GULAGS, like GITMO, outside the United States?

Although I don't believe any 911 airplane passengers or crewmembers wound up at Guantanamo, how would we know if they did? "Transparancy" of this Government? I don't think so.

And if DICTATOR OBAMA decides he "doesn't like" something I've written; I could be "stripped naked" and "getting waterboarded" in GITMO by this time tomorrow; just as well as YOU, or anyone else the "MAN" behind the Dictator Obama puppet "doesn't like".

THAT SCARES THE HELL OUT OF ME and it should scare the HELL out of EVERYBODY else.

I actually "voted" for that FOOOKER, because he "promised" to CLOSE GWB's GITMO Prison Camp, and put an END to the TORTURE. That SOB LIED to us.

And the "excuses" for NOT CLOSING IT are so GD LAME it isn't even FUNNY. Get this. Reason Numero Uno for NOT CLOSING GITMO is: MONEY! WTF??
"They" say we can't "afford" to reactivate, or rebuild a prison in Illinois to hold the GITMO prisoners.

What kind of a LIE is that? If you look at the "Consolidated Annual Financial Report" of any State, or Governmental entity having a Prison; you'll see its "Prison System" is one of its most PROFITABLE MONEY MAKING ENTERPRISES! DUH? How stooopid do they think us sheeple are?

My next question is just as Baa Baa Baaadd: How much does it cost for someone to make a meal for a prisoner near Chicago, Illinois... as compared to the cost of a prisoner meal in GITMO, supplied by a (Haliburton-esc) Subcontractor in that "remote" location? whistle.gif



You and me both, Island Pilot. I tell people this stuff and they look at me like I am crazy.Some probably think I AM, some have to tell themselves that to keep the delusion that all is normal and fine in place, and some know I am right and scared to death to say anything. People really are asleep in this country. Of course the excuses to keep Guantanomo open are lame. They don't really have an argument.
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elreb
post Apr 7 2011, 12:19 AM
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QUOTE (albertchampion @ Apr 6 2011, 04:41 PM) *
it actually goes way beyond that. the prisons are filled mostly with young black men. it is a racist artefact.

Albert,

I do not disagree with you but a lot of Hispanic and Latino brothers are also victimized along with our Black brothers.

Anyone seen this movie = http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rendition_(film)
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Johnny Angel
post Apr 8 2011, 10:09 PM
Post #19





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From: Pittsburgh Pa USA
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Lights..

You made the statement that when we tell Sheepeople this stuff they think we are Crazy.
(just because we are crazy, dont mean we are stupid)

20 yeaars ago when CIA WhistleBlower John Stockwell was traveling the country exposing the CIA`s Terrorrism, False Flag operations, explaining the Military Industrial complex & Drug smuggling connections, people would ask him why he cares.. There is nothing you can do to stop it and the Main Stream Media is Igonoring you.. "The Public just dont want to hear this stuff"

John Stockwell replied..
""When I Die, I can look into GOD`s eye and say, GOD, You Know I tried."
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amazed!
post Apr 9 2011, 02:20 PM
Post #20





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Great story Johnny!
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