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Our Declaration Of Independence; Constitution; And Bill Of Rights, General Discussion of these documents and their "relevance" to

IslandPilot
post Apr 16 2011, 02:28 AM
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I have started this topic in response to "tume's" post in another Forum about TSA Groping of a 6 Year old girl.
Our "original discussion" begins here: http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/index.p...&p=10797465
I responded with: http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/index.p...&p=10797474
Tume's post from: here is quoted as follows: (the "quotes" in white boxes are mine, tume's comments are in the "regular text"... and my "response" will follow in the next post)
QUOTE
QUOTE (IslandPilot @ Apr 14 2011, 02:33 PM)
Tume: I would say your "legal interpretation" is entirely consistent with what I learned about US History, US Government, Our Constitution, and our Legal System from 7th Grade through High School... that would have been from 1959 to 1964. But many things seem to have "changed" since then.
To me from the distance in Europe as I study it, it still looks like the written law and pertinent precedents are in place and active. The US Congress has no power to change the Constitution. Fortunately. What I think looks to me changed is the approach, acceptation, attitude to it, total lack of enforcement face to the military junta which apparently governs the USA since I was still unborn.
Yesterday I was watching the movie War Made Easy and what was there especially disgusting for me was a citation from LBJ speech where he was apparently seriously talking about that they "...fight for selfdetermination, for the right of the Vietnamese to choose their own course, free election, without violence, without terror and without fear..." Yeah, the napalmed and agent oranged children, they surely agree. Now they grop the american children and to me it still looks like a result of the complete lack of the law enforcement facing the military junta governing USA. To me it looks being just matter of time until the Americans are killed on American soil by themTM en masse as the OKC or 9/11 was a teaser for. They still prefer to send them to be killed abroad, together with the masses of civilians there. But the inevitable economic decline the imperial politics brings together with the obsoleteness of the infrastructure can soon make it impossible to wage the wars abroad.
QUOTE
QUOTE
The current "crop" of our Legislative, Executive, and Judicial Agency personnel have been very good at "twisting" the "meanings" of the US Constitution... and "revising" our "laws" and "legal system", so it no longer RESEMBLES anything I was taught back in the 1960s.

Our "Declaration of Independence" and "Bill of Rights" today seem to be "nothing" more than "interesting" historical documents. The way that the the "US EMPIRE" acts today; is NO DIFFERENT than the BRITISH EMPIRE acted 225 years ago... which is why Our Forefathers Revolted against it, in the first place.
Sorry, but I think it should be repeated over and over. There still is written in the Declaration of Independence:
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. --That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. (just a legal note: The Declaration of Independence is the law which constitutes United States as the legal entity. The Constitution of the United States just says what are the constitution-government rules of such entity-union of States. That's why you celebrate the 4th July, not September 17th. If the Declaration of Independence would be abolished it would mean the United States no longer exist in the legal sense and under the law of land it would most probably in legal sense become partly possesion of the United Kingdom, Kingdom of Spain, Russian Federation, Republic of France, Kingdom of Havaii and Republic of Texas and Indians. (If I've forget something I appologize to the pertinent parties) Who knows if it wouldn't be better if the Americans themselves aren't able to enforce even the Declaration and Constitution..)

there is also still written in the 14th amendment sec. 3:
No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.
to my knowledge it was never abolished.

What if the majority in the US Congress is already uneligible due to the 14th Amendment sec. 3. because they have given aid and comfort to the enemies of the Constitution of the United States? Can they vote themselves back? Nope. They would need two thirds in each House of the ones who still are eligible... The same for the executive and judicial branch... looks like a judicial Convention would be only peaceful mean left to solve the situation - if only also the State legislative bodies weren't corrupted mostly the same way as the federal government.
QUOTE
QUOTE
We are no longer a "Nation of Laws"; in which the Government derives its POWER from the PEOPLE; so if our "Government" doesn't "FEEL" like complying with the LAW.... they WON'T.
It very much looks like the infamous democracy. But not the modern one, the ancient greek one - where a tiny "aristocracy" was voting what they wanted and the rest were slaves. Even the ancient roman empire looks better, they at least weren't so dangerous for the rest of the world not having the nuclear weapons, aircraft carriers and who knows what else...

Back to the topic - I think it would be perfectly legal to bring Pistole, Napolitano, Chertoff & comp. to the Grand Jury to answer in capital process. Better sooner than later.
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Sanders
post Apr 16 2011, 05:10 AM
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Is your birth certificate printed in capital letters? Then you are an asset of the IMF/World-Bank in Switzerland.

You are not, legally, protected by the US Constitution, they've long side-stepped that.

If you are a "U.S. citizen", then you are chattel beholden to the bankers who hold the mortgage on the bankrupt United State of America.

If you want to become a citizen of your own state, or an American citizen, you can (totally different in legal standing from a US citizen) do that.

People go on about our Constitutional rights ... they don't exist for ordinary US citizens - legally. In order to, legally, make any claim regarding Constitutional rights, you have to do a lot of homework and file a lot of papers.

It can be done, in quite short order ... if you know what you are aiming for.
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GroundPounder
post Apr 16 2011, 07:16 AM
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look at (15) (A) in the link:

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/uscode28...02----000-.html
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tumetuestumefais...
post Apr 16 2011, 11:17 AM
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QUOTE (GroundPounder @ Apr 16 2011, 12:16 AM) *

I don't want to edify anybody but I think it is good to note the name of your country is the "United States of America" -as such it was recognized, as a land won in the war and sovereigned by the Treaty of Paris signed on September 3 1783, which recognized the Provisional Articles signed in Paris on November 30 1782 (-of which the Article 1 is in effect to this days) and subsequently was recognized by all other nations in the world under this name (- the entity "United States" is not a recognizable subject of international law, nor there is any public international corporate law, which would recognize the "United States Inc.") and later enlarged by accessions and acquisitions.

It is also good to note that at the time of the Treaty of Paris ratification no federation of the 13 states united under legal entity recognized as "United States of America" existed. So is it be the same legal entity as the "United States" "Federal corporation" mentioned in the 28 USC? The term corporation means legal entity under domestic law, usually with limited liability, created under corporate laws.

Also the preamble establishes the name of the constituted entity "United States of America" in the Constitution for the United States of America (which is one of the legal name of the document used promiscue with the legal name Constitution of the United States in the very document, and expressly recognises its independence as a legal entity established in 1776 in the signing statement. This entity cannot be legally abolished or superseded by any legal act of any branch of the federal government. Such authority is held only by the 3/4 of the State legislative bodies or Conventions - and to my knowledge it was never used in such sense. There was a secessionist attempt in the american civil war, but because it was militarily unsuccessful the integrity of the United States of America was reestablished and the Constitution remains together with its later Amendments the supreme law of land in the United States of America.

It is true that the Constitution of the United States (of America) uses the terms United States and United States of America promiscue, once it speaks about the President of the United States of America and then about the President of the United States for example, but it doesn't mean it establishes two entities one under the name "United States of America" and another under the name "United States".

Some argue that the District of Columbia Organic Act of 1871 established such a corporation UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, but I don't find anything like that in the bill. Some also argue that in the Washington D.C. is the constitutional protection inapplicable, which is clearly contradicted by many Supreme Court decisions, e.g. recently by the high profile 2nd Amendment gun control case Washington District of Columbia v. Heller which was decided against D.C.

So is there a "United States Inc."? In fact I don't know. The 28 USC clearly talks about the "United States" "Federal corporation", which could mean the United States can sue and be sued as a legal entity in the domestic process of law, it still doesn't show there is an entity United States Inc. moreover identical with the legal entity United States of America recognized by the international law. Hints welcomed.

This post has been edited by tumetuestumefaisdubien: Apr 16 2011, 11:26 AM
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GroundPounder
post Apr 16 2011, 03:55 PM
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a guy wrote to the lewrockwell blog:

"I’m 66 years old and it’s embarrassing to realize how I’ve been gamed by my “betters” all these years — a cash cow to the financial elites, a maze rat to the social engineers, and a mark to the politician con men, or may be Hayek’s term “Serf” captures it best."

at least this guy came to some realization, some people never figure it out.
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tumetuestumefais...
post Apr 16 2011, 09:06 PM
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QUOTE (GroundPounder @ Apr 16 2011, 08:55 AM) *
a guy wrote to the lewrockwell blog:

"I’m 66 years old and it’s embarrassing to realize how I’ve been gamed by my “betters” all these years — a cash cow to the financial elites, a maze rat to the social engineers, and a mark to the politician con men, or may be Hayek’s term “Serf” captures it best."

at least this guy came to some realization, some people never figure it out.

Nice to mention Hayek, he more or less predicted what will happen already before the guy was born. Unfortunately nobody was listening and it doesn't seem much many listen even now. It is interesting that Orwell, although praising the Road to Serfdom Book, also stated: the "return to 'free' competition means for the great mass of people a tyranny probably worse, because more irresponsible, than that of the state." Which proved untrue already at that time with the stalinist regime, and later with the maoist and its clones in Cambodia or North Korea etc. But the merger of states with corporate monopolies and cartels (which is in fact what Mussolini called fascism) and gradual upgrade of this to the supranational level paradoxicly using the extremes of the ideology of the Hayeks colleague Friedmann of the so called free trade finally led to the depletion of the national spirit of the local protectionism and realization of the Orwells prediction which criticized Hayek - which in fact how it is looks now more resembles the Aldous Huxley Brave new world idea - people being serfs thinking that they are being free, while in fact they don't have much power to govern their own affairs anymore. A funny paradox of the predictions...
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albertchampion
post Apr 16 2011, 09:46 PM
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i am tempted to respond to this thread.

as one who once had the bursar's sinecure to a secure future.

the united states of america has always been a bit of a fraud.

but it was ed bernays who iced that cake. during the wilson regime.

and the inhabitants of north america have been engorging themselves on that sugar ever since.

and for most of the diners, to their detriment.

the usa is the piratical successor to the british bunch of bandits.

and there is probably no erasure of this piratical structure. the electronification of ballots, that the intell services promoted, has exterminated forever any semblance of democratic institutions.

wake up, as lunk says on his posts. we are living in a neo-feudal country. and there is no reversing that via fraudulent vote counting.

and there is no chance of a successful insurrection. tumbrils for the amerikan aristocracy won't be running here. for the serfs, yes. for the gangsters/banksters - NO!

and that is the way it is. will always be, i think.

there are no more walter and victor reuthers. there are no more workers who can see themselves as serfs. and that is the real issue, how the state has persuaded so many of the citizenry that they have never had it so good...that being a citizen in the new roman empire is wonderful status.
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IslandPilot
post Apr 17 2011, 01:38 AM
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I got tired before I got a chance to respond to tume's thoughts... so I'll do it now. I'm glad to see the extra participation, thanks.

tume is quite a scholar, and has studied many things. I appreciate his written "accent", and wish that I could write a "second language" as well as he. Tume's statements are basically unchanged in the following section... my comments are indented and italicized... to make it easier to follow... I hope.

QUOTE
To me from the distance in Europe as I study it, it still looks like the written law and pertinent precedents are in place and active. The US Congress has no power to change the Constitution.
>>>> The US Congress CAN change the Constitution by "Ammending" it. They haven't done this very often... 27 times since 1789. The first 10 Ammendments are known as the "Bill of Rights". They were added to the Constitution in 1791. The US Constitution, including the Bill of Rights is supposed to be the "Supreme Law of the Land".

Fortunately. What I think looks to me changed is the approach, acceptation, attitude to it, total lack of enforcement face to the military junta which apparently governs the USA since I was still unborn.
Yesterday I was watching the movie War Made Easy and what was there especially disgusting for me was a citation from LBJ speech where he was apparently seriously talking about that they "...fight for selfdetermination, for the right of the Vietnamese to choose their own course, free election, without violence, without terror and without fear..." Yeah, the napalmed and agent oranged children, they surely agree.
>>>> Your observations about "enforcement" and "military junta" very sadly seems to be correct. I agree with your statements about LBJ and the illegal "Vietnam War", and I still cannot tell you "why" it happened, or "what" it was for... but some Corporations made a LOT of MONEY as a result.

Now they grop the american children and to me it still looks like a result of the complete lack of the law enforcement facing the military junta governing USA. To me it looks being just matter of time until the Americans are killed on American soil by themTM en masse as the OKC or 9/11 was a teaser for. They still prefer to send them to be killed abroad, together with the masses of civilians there. But the inevitable economic decline the imperial politics brings together with the obsoleteness of the infrastructure can soon make it impossible to wage the wars abroad.
>>>>> Exactly as you say... What "other results" can we expect, if nothing is done to change our current path. Our future is very dark. If only 50% of our citizens could see these things as clearly as you, and recognize how important this is... we would have a "chance". But, already they are either too "drugged up" or "dumbed down" by Media Propaganda and 9/11 "special effects"... to know, or to care.

Sorry, but I think it should be repeated over and over. There still is written in the Declaration of Independence:We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. --That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.
>>>> I too, agree great words and high ideals should be repeated.

(just a legal note: The Declaration of Independence is the law which constitutes United States as the legal entity. The Constitution of the United States just says what are the constitution-government rules of such entity-union of States. That's why you celebrate the 4th July, not September 17th.
>>>> tume: your "legal note" here is "incorrect"... allow me to explain... in "average citizen layman terms": The "Declaration of Independence" is not a "LAW"; and was never intended to become a LAW.
It is a statement adopted by the Continental Congress on July 4, 1776, which announced that the thirteen American colonies then at war with Great Britain were now independent states, and thus no longer a part of the British Empire. In June and July of 1776 delegates from the 13 Colonies met in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania to discuss and "vote" on "declaring their Independence" from Great Britian. The document was "effectively" signed on July 4, 1776... and sent to King George... to OFFICIALLY state our INTENTIONS and REASONS for SEVERING all ties to ENGLAND. This is why July 4th is celebrated as our "Nation's Birthday". The "signers" of the Declaration were very BRAVE men as they were, basically, signing their own "death warrants"... if they were captured by the British. They and their families paid a high price for our Independence.

If the Declaration of Independence would be abolished it would mean the United States no longer exist in the legal sense and under the law of land it would most probably in legal sense become partly possesion of the United Kingdom, Kingdom of Spain, Russian Federation, Republic of France, Kingdom of Havaii and Republic of Texas and Indians.
>>>> You raise some interesting points here... which are subject to arguement...
1) Before the DOI was accomplished, many delegates in the Continential Congress were still "hoping" to "negotiate" a "peaceful" settlement with King George, to mitigate their differences. Yet all these efforts resulted in even greater abuses by King George and his "Parliment". Also the American Revolution would not be successful against the greater resources of the British Empire in terms of weapons, ships, supplies, soldiers, sailors, and finances... At the time the DOI was being signed, British Ships were entering New York Harbor filled with German Mercenaries to fight against our "Yankee Doodle Dandys".
Our forefathers could not expect ANY HELP or "assistance" from Spain or FRANCE, without making such a SERIOUS and "CLEAR CUT" Declaration of Independence to SEVER ALL TIES to the British Empire. Until the colonists were willing to RISK THEIR VERY LIVES to cast off the British Rule; why should any other Nation get involved in an "internal civil" insurgency? What would they have to gain, if Britian regained Control of their Colonies?.... Absolutely NOTHING!... and they would have MUCH TO LOSE.
Note:
This is why it makes me angry when the US Empire enters into several wars to "help oppressed citizens of a Country to overthrow its Leadership to establish a "more Democratic Nation". WHY should we do this, when NONE of these "citizens" have ever been able to get enough of their SHIT TOGETHER; or have the "BALLS" to even "COPY" our "Declaration of Independence" to send it to their "dictator". Did you ever see a "Declaration of Independence" from the people of South Korea? South Vietnam? Kuwait? Iraq? Iran? Afghanistan? Pakistan? Egypt? and now LIBYA? HELL NO! So why in HELL do we squander LIVES and Precious Resources if the "people" we are supposedly "helping" topple their dictator aren't even willing to RISK signing their names to a piece of paper, like the DOI! To HELL with that BS!

2) Initially, the "Declaration of Independence" was a "minor" official notification to King George... and was "ignored" for a period of time after it was signed. When our Revolution was successful, the Continential Congress met and formed a Constitutional Convention to Draft the US Constitution, to describe the FORM and STRUCTURE for the GOVERNMENT of our NEW SOVIERGN NATION. This SIMPLE document EXPLAINS the DUTIES and RESPONSIBILITIES and LIMITATIONS for THREE SEPARATE BRANCHES for our "REPRESENTATIVE REPUBLIC" (NOT A "DEMOCRACY"). It describes a "system" of "checks and balances" between the Three branches of Government. The "Constitution" established the Government of our Nation, which really couldn't "operate" as an "Individual Soverign Nation" until it was "ratified" and signed by the delegates of the 13 STATES, of the United States of America, which happened in 1789.

I am placing the "Preamble" to the Constitution here to help "explain" its purpose:
I still LOVE how it starts out: WE THE PEOPLE.... PEOPLE LIKE ME... DAMN IT!

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
Now that's what our Constitution is supposed to be! Period! I couldn't have said it better myself.

(If I've forget something I appologize to the pertinent parties) Who knows if it wouldn't be better if the Americans themselves aren't able to enforce even the Declaration and Constitution..)
>>>> The Declaration of Independence was "enforced" when we (initially?) kicked every last remnant of the BRITISH EMPIRE outta here! That's a Done Deal... (except for the "elite banksters" and our "english" court system; maybe??)
The American People "should" be able to "enforce" their Constitution... but it may already be too late.

there is also still written in the 14th amendment sec. 3:
No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.
to my knowledge it was never abolished.

What if the majority in the US Congress is already uneligible due to the 14th Amendment sec. 3. because they have given aid and comfort to the enemies of the Constitution of the United States? Can they vote themselves back? Nope. They would need two thirds in each House of the ones who still are eligible... The same for the executive and judicial branch... looks like a judicial Convention would be only peaceful mean left to solve the situation - if only also the State legislative bodies weren't corrupted mostly the same way as the federal government.
>>>>> MMMM Very Interesting.... Every single member of Congress, (535 of them at last count)... is "sworn in" and takes the following OATH:
"I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter. So help me God."

I think maybe only a half-dozen or so "members of congress" have not violated that oath in several ways... by "allowing illegal TSA searches".... "illegal wars".... illegal Torture.... and GITMO prison camp... for a few examples....

It very much looks like the infamous democracy. But not the modern one, the ancient greek one - where a tiny "aristocracy" was voting what they wanted and the rest were slaves. Even the ancient roman empire looks better, they at least weren't so dangerous for the rest of the world not having the nuclear weapons, aircraft carriers and who knows what else...
>>>> That is a very GOOD and Correct observation I am afraid to say...

Back to the topic - I think it would be perfectly legal to bring Pistole, Napolitano, Chertoff & comp. to the Grand Jury to answer in capital process. Better sooner than later.
>>>>> Of course it would be "legal"... but it will NEVER HAPPEN... because the present Judicial system is filled with "appointees" made by the "Executive" powers... Just look at poor April Gallop and her 911 Pentagon case against Cheney and Rumsfeld.... she goes into Federal Court to face George Bush's Cousin as a Judge to decide her case... who isn't ETHICAL enough to "disqualify" himself... dunno.gif

I hope my extra info was at least a little helpful.... for now.... that's the basic "7th Grade" version... salute.gif
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IslandPilot
post Apr 17 2011, 04:10 AM
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Albert, you see with clear eyes, you speak the truth. I am not stupid or naiive, I'm just trying to keep my "rose colored glasses" on a little longer.

I have always disliked "History". I hated having to learn about the Roman Empire, the British Empire, and the Rise and Fall of the Third Reich....

I can "relate" a little better to American History before the Civil War,
I liked Paul Revere, riding through town like an idiot and hollering his head off...
while Ben Franklin was printing "alternate" news in "Little Richard's Almanac"... and "inventing" neat stuff... before entertaining the "ladies of Paris"
and John Paul Jones with his "plucky" attitude on Old Ironsides when he "hadn't yet begun to fight"...
and Washington was "the Man" crossing the Delaware... and "toughing it out" at Valley Forge...
and the Green Mountain Boys taking over Fort Ticonderoga... (did I spell that right?) dunno.gif
and Patrick Henry told it like it was... "Gimme Liberty of Death" or Go F...k off!
and that guy putting his 5 inch "John Handcock" on that "Independence Death Warrant" so King George wouldn't have to put on his glasses to read it!
When "Patriot" and "Minuteman" referred to "guys in a Militia" instead of guided missiles.
while Frances Scott Key kept an eye on Fort Sumpter, just makin' sure "our Flag was still there."
while Betsy Ross was sewing a new flag in her rocking chair...

Now those were Citizens we all can be Proud of!

And look at the Sorry Bunch of Wimps we got running the country today... it must be some kind of "inverse square law".... as the Country grew Bigger... those running it (those we can see) became "smaller" and "smaller"...
out of 535 people in Congress; you can throw maybe 525 of them away, and never notice the difference.... except for their payrolls and benefits. That's pretty sad.

Enough of the "whining"... crybaby2.gif already... crybaby.gif

They made us learn that "HISTORY" and told us "History repeats itself"; so we could prevent it next time. Somehow we Screwed Up... or "somebody" screwed up...

I remember "feeling" the stinking Roman Empire... and the British Empire.... and the stupid Nazis were just "junk" from the long ago past... that I'd NEVER have to THINK ABOUT for the rest of my life. What an idiot, I was.

Today, I live in London-Rome... 4 years after Hitler has taken over running the joint. I'm kinda glad I'm not a Jew... but I'm not so happy that I'm not Black...and I ain't very happy being on the "winning" Empire's side... so far.

It sucks to be a Limey-Roman and to know "MY GOVERNMENT" is treating its citizens, as well as the guys in Gitmo, the same way the Romans treated "Christians".... or the way them Redcoats treated our GOOD COLONISTS! And How can that happen.... after ALL WE'VE gone through so far??

My grandparents came here from Germany in the 20s, after WWI, when Germany was Starving to death before Hitler showed up. They went to night school to learn English, AMERICAN HISTORY.... and about our GOVERNMENT too. They became US Citizens... and were very PROUD of it. My Grandpa ALWAYS had a picture of the CURRENT PRESIDENT hanging above his kitchen table. And he ALWAYS FLEW THE FLAG on holidays and whenever we went up to his cottage.

And it was always a "mystery" to me.... like how could the "GERMAN PEOPLE", who are fairly "intelligent" to begin with.... HOW COULD THEY LET such a MADMAN like Hitler take CONTROL of their COUNTRY and their LIVES so COMPLETELY..... without a MASSIVE REVOLUTION to GET HIM OUTTA THERE...

I could NEVER FIGURE THAT OUT....

Until I looked up into the MOST BEAUTIFUL BLUEST SKY I've EVER SEEN in my LIFE...on September 12. 2001, knowing that MY FREEDOM to FLY ANYWHERE, ANYTIME I WANTED, was now LOST AND GONE FOREVER! Because GWB said so!

That Beautiful Blue Sky was SO SILENT, It scared me half to DEATH.... especially when I noticed that the "transponder reply" light was now "blinking" in my airplane on the ground here... and it had NEVER DONE THAT BEFORE! And it hasn't STOPPED doing that since.

I think that "blinking" light means: ACHTUNG! Welkum to AMERIKA IP! Zeig Heil!

QUOTE
the united states of america has always been a bit of a fraud.

the usa is the piratical successor to the british bunch of bandits.
and there is probably no erasure of this piratical structure. the electronification of ballots, that the intell services promoted, has exterminated forever any semblance of democratic institutions.

wake up, as lunk says on his posts. we are living in a neo-feudal country. and there is no reversing that via fraudulent vote counting.

and there is no chance of a successful insurrection.
and that is the way it is. will always be, i think.
...that being a citizen in the new roman empire is wonderful status.

Yup! U Betcha! on everything you said, except for one thing...
"Being a citizen in the New Roman Empire"..... SUCKS!! salute.gif
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tumetuestumefais...
post Apr 17 2011, 04:50 PM
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QUOTE (IslandPilot @ Apr 16 2011, 06:38 PM) *
>>>> The US Congress CAN change the Constitution by "Ammending" it. They haven't done this very often... 27 times since 1789. The first 10 Ammendments are known as the "Bill of Rights". They were added to the Constitution in 1791. The US Constitution, including the Bill of Rights is supposed to be the "Supreme Law of the Land".

I think you're not right with this. The Congress can by two thirds in each House propose the Amendments, as can two thirds of the States propose a Convention call for such a purpose. The Amendment cannot enter force without being ratified by three fouths of the States either by State Legislatures or Conventions. So in fact the federal Congress has no power to change the Constitution, this power is in any case reserved to the States and three fourths of them must agree with any change. see Article V.
QUOTE
>>>> Your observations about "enforcement" and "military junta" very sadly seems to be correct. I agree with your statements about LBJ and the illegal "Vietnam War", and I still cannot tell you "why" it happened, or "what" it was for... but some Corporations made a LOT of MONEY as a result.

I think the stated reason was the "fight against commies". It could even seem a legitimate reason, because commies also didn't respected the selfdetermination and their aim was clearly "world (bloody) revolution", based on pursuing outrightly utopian ideas, using open terror in pursuing openly global imperial goals.
Vietnam looks to me like proxy war with Russia and China.
Unfortunately the result of the unsuccessfull war on the end, which got often even nastier then what the commies were doing, only led to the fixation of huge military-industrial complex power, already Ike ominously warned about in his farewell, which effectively took over the power in USA and kept it ever since, sucking large portion of the financial and human capital, while leaving the domestic infrastructure be greatly dependent on the foreign (the 14th amendment aid..?) sources, for which acquisition the empire of whole set of puppet regimes must be maintained, and gradually the US economy became less and less competitive, moreover less and less selfustainable, production outsourced, the infrastructure more and more obsolete, the life style more and more wasteful, and with the depletion of the domestic resources then even more dependent on the imperial politics, which is more and more difficult to maintain..
And even if we would refrain from the moral assessment and black'n'white judgments, the way how the USA developed in course of all this almost defies common sense. So no wonder even the people in USA don't much understand what is the reason for this and what was it for, except the faint idea someone made loads of money on it. To me after all it looks like selfdestruction (although most probably inflicted by fifth column): now we see the control and its technologies look to develope into ends which intimately resemble the kinds dreamed about by the commies. But in fact it is worse, because the system clearly becomes the imperial-fascist kind (even worse, see the note about Orwell-Hayek above), and is fervently globalized, leading to generalized disastrous economic decline, not recession, not depression, but a (very possible) default, caused partly by financial frauds, partly by ultimate depletion of the conventional resources not substituted for advanced technologies even they're fully available, often justified by the "pressure" of "public" although it is pressure of lobbies...while the former commie countries seem to thrive.
QUOTE
>>>>> Exactly as you say... What "other results" can we expect, if nothing is done to change our current path. Our future is very dark. If only 50% of our citizens could see these things as clearly as you, and recognize how important this is... we would have a "chance". But, already they are either too "drugged up" or "dumbed down" by Media Propaganda and 9/11 "special effects"... to know, or to care.

Yeah, the effects of miseducation, bad faiths and drugging looks to me be the most ominous, because as Ryan Thurston said: "Only group cappable of stopping US govt. are the people of the US" - the question is are they still able? I'm not much sure.
QUOTE
>>>> tume: your "legal note" here is "incorrect"... allow me to explain... in "average citizen layman terms": The "Declaration of Independence" is not a "LAW"; and was never intended to become a LAW.

...and that's the problem.
In fact it IS the law enacted by Congress (and understandably never abolished) -in both senses domestic and international, natural and universal - it is the most important law in US, maybe even in the world (because if really abolished, although I don't believe it is ever possible, the people are fu*ed...) - as more or less all declarations of independence in fact are - because they're the sovereign acts of law which found the states as the legal entities.
The Declaration of Independence is the very legal act which founded the independent USA - recognized by France by Treaty of Alliance in 1778 and in the diplomatic sense by Dutch recognition of John Adams as ambassador (I don't want to go in details because the overal situation then was very complicated and it was in fact something like WW0 involving in some way all colonial powers) as such is acknowledged in the signing statement of the Articles of Confederation (drafted and adopted by the same Congress just after the adoption of the Declaration), was later recognized by Provisional Articles and subsequently Treaty of Paris under the Law of Nations by British - and later also acknowledged in the signing statement of the US Constitution.
It is a legal act which resulted from the decisions of the Second Continental Congress in 1775-6 and in fact the Declaration was written and enacted when already the Independence War was in full swing -to make the alliance treaties legally possible.

The declarations are also important to declare legal intentions - in this particular case the natural law of equality in rights (which was a real revolution then at least in thought allegedly inspired by Philip Mazzei, although criticized as hypocritical, because of the slavery institution in USA, attitude towards the Indians, endemic racism and relatively very high class inequality profoundly affecting the practical possibility of the rights exrecise, persisting, resisting and even rising - in this core sense I think the Declaration still awaits to be fulfiled and it looks like it doesn't get much better with it for the last decades and the black president owned by the Wall Street&Pentagon is still more like a symbol of hypocrisy than anything much more) and also the practical reasons for creating the state. And as such are recognized at least abroad -if successful.

The states aren't created by a paper of a constitution - even the US Constitution is quite exceptional and served as inspiration for many - it is just and institution of the form of government (in US history the third one - after the united States of America military alliance founded in 1775 and subsequently the Confederation which acknowledged the state name as "The United States of America")
The states are created by the legal acts like the Declaration of Independence and the whole chain of subsequent acts, often involving risk of own life, where the adoption of a constitution is just one of the steps -and Americans had the two subsequent, because the Confederation was too weak to face the reality of that times.

A state is idea, phenomena of mutual defense of the common interests of a nation. And the paradigm of the gevernment (both positive - what we want - life, freedom, happiness... - and negative - all the nasty things british did to us...) anticipates what the state should be like. The Declaration is the answer to the question: what? The Constitution is answer to the question: how? That's why Alex Jones has the funny motto: "The Answer to the 1984 is 1776." (Not 1787). The key words are duty, equality in inalienable rights. The Bill of Rights doesn't name them, it is there to help to secure them.

(Just for example we had also a declaration of independence in Czechoslovakia - written in Washington, signed in Paris and adopted in Prague...and two almost immediately subsequent and I don't know how many later constitutions, which are adopted and changed just by three fifths of the parliament and only what rests more or less unchanged is the Bill of Rights. Slovaks have also their declaration of independence by which they in 1992 seceded from Czechoslovakian federation, founded in 1969 after the unitary myth of the "Czechoslovakian nation" instituted by the St.Germain Treaty was already untenable. Now we have the Lisbon Treaty a constitution-non-constitution of the EU, where nobody even knows if we are legally the members, because there demonstrably was no EU treaties translation into the Czech language at the time when we had the accession referendum to them, where just something like 42.6% of the voters voted YES and theyTM interpreted it as successfull accession aproval. The EU bill of rights is valid-invalid because nobody knows if it applies to the Czech republic or not...so it is quite crazy, especially when we see from the polls that Czechs, if asked now, would not vote YES to become part of the EU -as majority of them apparently didn't even in the 2003 referendum...)

And the call to duty which is flatly stated in the Declaration of Independence, as I see it, has the power of the most supreme universal law ever written in words - because practically without fulfilling the duty to abolish it - "whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive" to security of the inalienable rights, no more protected by the government which ceased "deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed" and when is clear that there is the "long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object" evincing "a design to reduce' the people "under absolute Despotism"
... without fulfilling the duty the rights will get for sure alienated - and it would be at least an insult towards the Creator, whoever he is, who endowed the man with them, and without which the creature, whoever it is, is not a free man, not speaking happy, not speaking equal to his ruler.

I'm afraid the problem here is not so much a lack of declarations of independences of South Korea, South Vietnam, Kuwait, Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Egypt, Libya...but the lack of independence of USA (e.g. in resources most dependent on this Earth and trying to get them for the ancient greek democracy imported only), the lack of freedom there, the lack of pursuit of the happiness there and for anywhere, the lack of the equality to the rulers.

I'm not much sure the reason why Jefferson wrote the part of the Declaration I've cited was there just to provide reasons why to kick the asses of the Brits. To me it looks like the reasons were much much more universal, because apparently not just the British in the times of the wanker George III want to make the people serfs. I would think the duty declared there is a natural law.

- said in commonman words: either you'll kick the asses of the ill rulers or they'll make you slaves and kick yours.

The problem here clearly isn't the document called the US Constitution, problem is that all the institutions instituted by it somehow actually behave quite differently than apparently was intended i.a. by the preamble you cite and often the ends they pursue, wittingly or unwittingly, are quite an opposite and the oaths are broken on notorious everyday basis, almost never punished although it is one of the most repugniant crime, which usually the head was axed down for to get the inocent body rid of the rotten brain.. - the union is more pretended than perfect, the justice rapidly disappears replaced by equality in suffering, the tranquility is more a result of tranquilizers and hypnotization by ogerish lies than social and economic development, the defence is confused for attacks, provided more by mercenaries and just the common costs remain reserved to be paid by poor while the rich make profit from it, the welfare is more and more selective than general and the liberty blesses just those who enslave others including posterity by unpayable debts.
And not just that, even facing the above also the constituents behave somehow differently then one would expect from the really free people. The right for freedon is somehow not exercised and if it is then it is often quite bizzare (I hope I must not show examples...).
Sorry to be so frank - Isn't it like even the brightest ones ask for independence declarations papers of others, as a policeman the suspicious individuums on the street, calling their own papers "minor", the others call great and apparently still also seek the ways to fulfil it, rather to just write it - because it already was anyway written on numerous occassions?!!
QUOTE
>>>>> MMMM Very Interesting.... Every single member of Congress, (535 of them at last count)... is "sworn in" and takes the following OATH:
"I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter. So help me God."

I think maybe only a half-dozen or so "members of congress" have not violated that oath in several ways... by "allowing illegal TSA searches".... "illegal wars".... illegal Torture.... and GITMO prison camp... for a few examples....

I'm not much good in reading Congressional voting records. here is Patriot Act + reauthorization record Millitary Commissions Act record H.R.1955 record
Paul, who is sympathetic to me... who else? It would be good to know the names. Kucinich.. McKinney..
One interesting thing btw - Paul again won the CPAC straw poll, so apparently there are some people in US who appreciate...
QUOTE
>>>>> Of course it would be "legal"... but it will NEVER HAPPEN... because the present Judicial system is filled with "appointees" made by the "Executive" powers... Just look at poor April Gallop and her 911 Pentagon case against Cheney and Rumsfeld.... she goes into Federal Court to face George Bush's Cousin as a Judge to decide her case... who isn't ETHICAL enough to "disqualify" himself... dunno.gif

I thought the Grand Jury (mandated for all capital crimes by 5th Amendment) indiction is not decided by appointees, and that a judge is a "staff" there with no power to dismiss the case and that the indiction in 18 USC §241 case for conspiracy against the 4th Amendment right would implicitly involve 14th Amendment sec. 3 application against the officers under oath and would effectively mean no bail if the Congress would not immediately affirm the immunities by vote of two thirds in both Houses. (I would think that even before something like that would have chance to happen the revolution would be already in progress because all the criminals under oath would sh*t their pants.)

Imagine the conditions in the 18th century. Just horses, muzzle load rifles and couple of brave people. No internet, no electricity, no cars, no telephone, no grand juries, most of the people indiferent or loyalists... And they won.

But back to the todays reality. I don't think it will not happen because the judges are corrupt. I think that it will not happen because the people can't imagine it happen. And anyway a process which would be needed in USA to solve the situation in peaceful way, not by WWIII or north-south-west-east-war-for-liberaation-of-free-people-if-only-they-would-want-to-be-free would most probably overshadow the Nuremberg trial.

...again the question about the Germans rapturously letting the madmans (not just Hitler, who was merely a lunatic chosen to do the job for his one ball lunacy as the syfilitic Lenin in Russia) and their monstrous system takeover. Now on different continent... I've read a book about hitlerjugend recently, it was unbelievable set of the personal testimonies - it looked like they mostly believed the regime there is a kind of nice brave new world, that they grow to bring the freedom and order and high culture everywhere, and just the "inferior" people somehow didn't want to grasp it there an go kill themselves ...and then the desilusion came...
I think nobody can bring a freedom to anybody, the people must find it for themselves. For me the definition of freedom is simple: to keep own things firmly in own hands. The answer to the question how? I leave open, because anyway this is most probably the longest post here I've ever written. I appologize for the most incomprehensible language ever. rolleyes.gif

This post has been edited by tumetuestumefaisdubien: Apr 18 2011, 05:49 AM
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amazed!
post Apr 18 2011, 05:13 PM
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TTT

I respectfully disagree. The DOI is not law. Like the Preamble to the Constitution, it is a grand philosophical statement of the desires and goals of the men of the time.

After the DOI and before the US Constitution were the Articles of Confederation, under which law the US Revolution was fought. The Continental Congress under those articles was generally considered to be a failure, even though we prevailed with the help of the French in the military battle.

The DOI commands nothing from anybody, and prohibits nothing from anybody. It is a grand statement, that is all. Yes, the foundation of this country's political thought and feelings in 1776, but no sort of legal document.
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GroundPounder
post Apr 18 2011, 07:00 PM
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let's just cut the crap and apply the litmus test shall we? rhetorical question.

can anybody on this forum go to sleep on 'their' property and not answer to anybody until doomsday? meaning, no property taxes etc? if you are being honest, then the answer is no. therefore you are a serf. simple. not complicated. no need to be verbose or legal, just telling it like it is.

gee, i forgot:

"If you tell the truth, make it funny or they'll kill you."

so here is the funny:

a guy walks into a bar and announces that he's got a terrific czech joke to tell. but before he can start, the bartender says, 'hold it right there, i'm czech.'
and the guy says, 'ok, i'll tell it very slowly.'
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elreb
post Apr 18 2011, 07:36 PM
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QUOTE (GroundPounder @ Apr 18 2011, 01:00 PM) *
can anybody on this forum go to sleep on 'their' property and not answer to anybody until doomsday? meaning, no property taxes etc?

My brother has to face this reality every year.

He has owned his house and land for 20 years…yet…due to the recession and lack of employment…”MUST” face the tax collector every year. [On the Court House steps]

The “County” could give a “Shit” about your problems…and will sell your house for taxes…and throw you and your children out into the streets.

Then these “Jerks” run ads on TV…as if you were a bum…
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GroundPounder
post Apr 18 2011, 08:59 PM
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QUOTE (elreb @ Apr 16 2011, 10:36 PM) *
Then these “Jerks” run ads on TV…as if you were a bum…[/b]


and have the balls to tell you that you are free...

well, not really balls (read temerity), since they are reading from a script, but you get the idea.
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elreb
post Apr 18 2011, 09:32 PM
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QUOTE (GroundPounder @ Apr 18 2011, 02:59 PM) *
and have the balls to tell you that you are free...

The truly sad part is that…City, County, State & Federal government employees are “Brain Washer” into believing that they are doing the “Right” thing because it protects “Their” jobs…

A government of “Government People” by the government people…for the government people…

200,000 new government jobs were created…and Americans will get the bill…
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tumetuestumefais...
post Apr 18 2011, 10:48 PM
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QUOTE (GroundPounder @ Apr 18 2011, 12:00 PM) *
let's just cut the crap and apply the litmus test shall we? rhetorical question.

can anybody on this forum go to sleep on 'their' property and not answer to anybody until doomsday? meaning, no property taxes etc? if you are being honest, then the answer is no. therefore you are a serf. simple. not complicated. no need to be verbose or legal, just telling it like it is.

Does it seem to me right that you wouldn't be a serf in a case there would be for the tax demanded a service, a representation of your interests, rights? Are there any, if you're perfectly honest?

With the mortgage crisis I'm not much sure now there was a representation of the property owners interests or rights if any left, but somehow it very much looks after the bailouts there was a perfect representation of the thieves contemporary political thinkers which came to steal appropriate the property using their predatory un-prohibitive loans of money made by pressing enter and then get paid for the pious job the nice bonuses by the very same (former) home owners, with just some rests to be paid by their offspring. ...and maybe again not just by the money

How it all comes, when to my knowledge they're often residents of tax paradises or tax-exempt? Where the service comes from and by whom it is paid? Not by you of course...

If I would link this back to the murphy's, or natural, or no-law, whatever one want's to call the DOI, it very much looks like somebody was kicked in the ass here and I'm afraid the fall guys which had so the ass kicked often even multiple times in a row proved to be the perfect target to be first robbed, then enslaved and/or made homeless and when redundant then euthanasied by their simmilarly obedient mates or by cold or hunger...and it will be all of course perfectly legal, because somebody said so like in the of course grand statement about grand statement from the department of homelandless servitudity of no commandments to duty. whistle.gif

(don't worry, it is all just a foolish czech joke, isn't it?)

This post has been edited by tumetuestumefaisdubien: Apr 18 2011, 11:45 PM
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albertchampion
post Apr 19 2011, 01:34 AM
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as dickens said long ago, the best of times, the worst of times.

personally, though i am on a plateau that at this moment renders me in the best of times, i feel that for too large a segment of the citizenry, it is the worst of times.

and what puzzles me is that those so disenfranchised seem to accept their status. as if they think that somehow their ship will come in and that there is a chance that they will become elevated out of their current straits.

i am scratching my head over this. the impoverished have decided to sit back and snack on popcorn and watch television? is that the way it is going to go down?

and while being further impoverished, the citizenry applauds the mulatto gangster and his continuation of the undeclared invasions of islamic sovereign nations.

i don't get it. do you get it?

why aren't we in the streets?

that is what i want to learn. why is it that the us citizenry has decided to implement the gangster state?
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amazed!
post Apr 19 2011, 09:00 AM
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Liberty dies to thunderous applause.
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GroundPounder
post Apr 19 2011, 12:29 PM
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i just ran across this today and started to read it. has anybody read this or understand fully the concept of 'sovereign'?

"the errant sovereigns handbook " by Augustus Blackstone
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IslandPilot
post Apr 19 2011, 06:32 PM
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QUOTE (albertchampion @ Apr 19 2011, 12:34 AM) *
as dickens said long ago, the best of times, the worst of times.

and what puzzles me is that those so disenfranchised seem to accept their status. as if they think that somehow their ship will come in and that there is a chance that they will become elevated out of their current straits.

In a former life, I "hung out" in the back alleys of downtown and metro Detroit. In fact, I even worked and went to school near Detroit City Airport. I associated with "disenfranchised" people, and picked up a few "insights" about their "acceptance of status".

I was dating my ex-wife, who lived in Detroit during the 1967 Riots, before it became: "The Murder Capital of the USA". Those were "touchy" times... when you "knew" you were surrounded by "ACTIVELY" disenfranchised people; and rightly so.

A few things happened to cause them to "chill out".

In 1968, the Detroit Tigers won the World Series.... we were afraid of another riot... but it was more of a "joint celebration".... Everybody in Detroit had "something" to be proud of... it was a temporary, but "glorious distraction" to the "realities" of life in Detroit back then.

Coleman A Young, a "black man" became MAYOR of Detroit... White suburbanites hated him just as much as Detroiters loved him. He may have been as much of a "crook" as the last white mayor... but he "changed" things for ALL Detroit citizens.

I was pretty much a "racist" at the time... and didn't like him... until having a casual conversation with my "Powerplant Instructor" at Detroit's Aeromechanics School. He was white and told me Mayor Young had done more for Detroit, than the last 10 White Mayors...
Mayor Young, despite all the "corruption allegations" and drama:
1) Was a "Tuskegee Airman"... one of those "black" guys trained to fly FIGHTERS over GERMANY during WWII; yet their "elite" group was subjected to just as much DISCRIMINATION as "regular" black men.
2) He "Brought home the BACON" from Washington DC. He got his DEMOCRATIC friends to send millions of dollars to help him "Move Detroit Forward".
3) He spent money to GET RID OF THE RATS! NO SHIT! He "bought" thousands of new GARBAGE TRUCKS, and "Millions" of Dumpsters and Wheeled Trash Containers... and employed people to pick up the trash.
4) He bought PLOWS for the front of the garbage trucks... and made every other street ONE WAY... so the streets could be passible during the winter.
5) He told all the "Crooks", Hoodlums, and Hookers, to "Hit Eight Mile"; because they weren't "welcome" in Detroit anymore. That angered northern Suburbanites... and I still don't know how he did it... I really can't describe how "bad" it was... but he "CLEANED the place UP"... ALOT!
6) He got together with Henry Ford II to build the Renassiance Center to "revitalize" downtown Detroit.
7) He put an end to "police brutality".

This "calmed" the people down...even if they still weren't very "hopeful" toward the future...

So the State of Michigan came to the "rescue"...With the MICHIGAN STATE LOTTERY...
so those with the THE LEAST, could contribute THE MOST to the State's rising deficits.
And they promoted the HELL out of it... especially in the POOREST neighboords.
Every "convience store" and gas station in the "hood" became a LOTTO outlet...

And when you have "no hope"... spending $2 to win a MILLION... makes PERFECT sense;
If you don't "Play"
you CAN'T WIN!
and what "other choices" do you have???

For the "disenfranchisied", they can;
1) leave town, go somewhere else "where things are better" or "it ain't so cold".
2) join the Military, and "take your chances" in Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Libya, etc
3) Die... either of Starvation... a bullet or knife wound... lack of Health Care... Overdose or bad Drugs... and the "AIDS Epidemic" also got "rid of" a lot of disenfranchised people.
QUOTE
and while being further impoverished, the citizenry applauds the mulatto gangster and his continuation of the undeclared invasions of islamic sovereign nations.
i don't get it. do you get it? why aren't we in the streets? that is what i want to learn.
why is it that the us citizenry has decided to implement the gangster state?


The "non-white" people in this country have been "oppressed" the most for the longest time. They most likely would be the FIRST to take to the streets... but they won't... because THEIR GUY is in Washington, (they think), so they aren't going to act "against" him...
because they haven't realized that he HASN'T DONE A DAM THING to CHANGE ANYTHING that GWB IMPLEMENTED! PERIOD!
And, as a "white guy", I can't point that out to them... without being called a "racist"! So you can see that Barry's "election" was a "perfect crime".

And then we have all those ILLEGAL Mexicans flooding across our southern border like a TSUNAMI... diluting the whole "POOL" of the "disenfranchised"... and changing the meaning of the term: "disenfranchised"...

And I'm just about ready, to go down to the bar... and to start drinking them 40oz beers for a buck... to watch some game on the WIDE SCREENS... and play that "KENO" (whatever the fuk that is?)... and maybe even buy my FIRST LOTTO TICKET!

Cause my options just get more and more "limited" every single day....
either that or maybe I can move to either CUBA or LIBYA...
or some other Country that doesn't have a
DEBT BASED PRIVATE CENTRAL BANKING SYSTEM
and doesn't take UROs or US Dollars...
cause I don't have any...

Maybe I could Marry a Libyan chick,
and get 50,000 gold-backed Gaddafi Bucks...
We could live happily ever after on the shores of Tripoli...
We could sail in the Mediteranian Sea...
And drink and swim in Gaddafi's water from the desert...

The Libyan War has NOTHING to do with the OIL...
It's about Gaddafi's WATER, and his GOLD!
Which HE still HAS,
even after financing the multi-billion dollar water project...
with "money created" by his own government owned CENTRAL BANK...
without incurring ANY DEBT, or COMPOUNDED INTEREST...

And WE are spending money we DON'T HAVE to INCREASE OUR DEBT
to some BANKSTER'S PRIVATE BANK... that they "created" for NOTHING...
so we can PAY INTEREST, and STAY IN DEBT to them FOREVER!!!

It's no wonder they want to get RID of HIM... they can't tolerate a "banking system" like his.
An "idea" like that could spread like wildfire around the World, and put them OUT OF BUSINESS!
And of course it explains why the alledged "rebel" forces have already established a "PRIVATE CENTRAL DEBT BANK" provided by "guess who"... DUH?

They should rename the "FEDERAL RESERVE" to something like:
"PLANTATION LIFE LONG DEBT BANK for SLAVES"!

The late Coleman Young, did have a "solution" for this problem...
for those "disenfranchised" people who "didn't like his City of Detroit"...
he told them to: "Vote with their feet, and leave."
Maybe he was "on to something"... salute.gif
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