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Evidence Strengthens To Support Wtc Aircraft Speed Analysis, PilotsFor911Truth.org

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rob balsamo
post Aug 8 2011, 05:55 PM
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Be sure to use the share and like buttons at top. Spread it everywhere!

(PilotsFor911Truth.org) - Since our article on WTC Aircraft Speed Analysis was written, more evidence has been gathered to reflect the research provided by Pilots For 9/11 Truth and in the film "9/11: World Trade Center Attack". A more thorough understanding and explanation of why V speeds are established based on wind tunnel tests performed by the manufacturer is also available virtually making the need to gather documents from Boeing based on wind tunnel testing, moot. We already have their results of such tests in the form of the V Speeds they have established through wind tunnel testing required by definition as outlined in the Illustrated Guide To Aerodynamics and all other related text.

The Argument - Reported speeds/control for the reported aircraft claimed -
"impossible"
"improbable",
"The Elephant In The Room"

The Evidence

Data -
NTSB


Boeing - Boeing spokeswoman Leslie Hazzard in this recording saying 500+ mph at 700 feet is impossible.


(Interviewer asks -) "So there's no way the aircraft could be going 500 mph at [700 ft] altitude then?"

Boeing Spokesperson - (Laughs) "Not a chance..."



Limits set by the
manufacturer based on flight/wind tunnel testing




The above is for a 767, reduce the speeds by 10 knots for a 757.

The speeds are based on the weight ranges in the A1NM Type Certificate data sheet which also give an altitude range.

VD = 420 KCAS to 17,854 ft/.91M above 23,000 ft, linear variation between these points.


The above diagram is good from sea level, up to almost 18,000 feet. Above that, the Vg diagram moves to the left. In other words, structural failure speeds are less in terms of Indicated at higher altitudes. Real pilots can see this as they climb. The Vmo indicator (Barber pole) actually moves to a lower airspeed once you climb above the crossover altitude. The reason for this is the aircraft is no longer limited by raw dynamic pressure, rather it is now becoming limited by the effects of Mach (both drag related, which is why EAS is calculated using Mach number and good to above Mach 2). A good explanation of this is shown here.

http://www.biggles-software.com/software/7..._40_vmo_mmo.htm

NASA Research





Precedent -

EA990 -

China Air 747SP

TWA 727

Simulator Reconstruction

Modified DC-8



All suffered in flight structural failure, crash and/or lost control and needed 10's of thousand of feet to recover, well below Vmo+150.... or was modified to exceed it's manufacturer's set limits in the case of the DC-8.



Numerous verified experts -


Captain Russ Wittenberg (ret)
30,000+ Total Flight Time
707, 727, 737, 747, 757, 767, 777, DC-8, L-1049, Learjet 24/25, L-188
Ground Instructor, Advanced Ground Instructor, Instrument Instructor, Flight Engineer Turbojet
Aircraft Dispatcher
Pan Am, United
United States Air Force (ret)
Over 100 Combat Missions Flown
Command time in:
- N591UA (Aircraft dispatched as United 93)
- N612UA (Aircraft dispatched as United 175)

Captain Ross Aimer
UAL Ret.
CEO, My Aviation Expert LLC
40 years and 30,000 hrs.
BS Aero
A&P Mech.
B-777/767/757/747/737/727/720/707, DC-10/-9/-8 Type ratings
Command time in:
- N591UA (Aircraft dispatched as United 93)
- N612UA (Aircraft dispatched as United 175)

Commander Ralph “Rotten” Kolstad
23,000 hours
27 years in the airlines
B757/767 for 13 years mostly international Captain with American Airlines.
20 years US Navy flying fighters off aircraft carriers, TopGun twice
civilian pilot flying gliders, light airplanes and warbirds
Command time in:
- N644AA (Aircraft dispatched as American 77)
- N334AA (Aircraft dispatched as American 11)

John Lear
Son of Bill Lear
(Founder, creator of the Lear Jet Corporation)
More than 40 years of Flying
19,000+ TT
23 Type ratings
Flight experience includes 707, DC-8, 727, L10-11

Jeff Latas
-Over 20 years in the USAF
--USAF Accident investigation Board President
--Flew the F-111, T38, and F-15E
--Combat experience in the F-15E includes Desert Storm and four tours of duty in Northern and Southern Watch
--Weapons Requirements Officer, USAF HQ, Pentagon
--Standard and Evaluations Flight Examiner, Command level
-Currently Captain for JetBlue Airways

Guy S. Razer, LtCol, USAF (Ret)
3,500+ Hours Total Flight Time
F-15E/C, F-111A/D/E/F/EF, F-16, F-18, B-1, Mig-29, SU-22, T-37/38, Various Cvilian Prop
Combat Time: Operation Northern Watch
USAF Fighter Weapons School Instructor
NATO Tactical Leadership Program Instructor/Mission Coordinator
USAF Material Command Weapons Development Test Pilot
Combat Support Coordination Team 2 Airpower Coordinator, South Korea
All Service Combat Identification Evaluation Team Operations Officer
Boeing F-22 Pilot Instructor
MS Aeronautical Studies, Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University

Dwain Deets
MS Physics, MS Eng
Former Director, Aerospace Projects, NASA Dryden Flight Research Center
Served as Director, Research Engineering Division at Dryden
Recipient of the NASA Exceptional Service Award
Presidential Meritorious Rank Award in the Senior Executive Service (1988)
Selected presenter of the Wright Brothers Lectureship in Aeronautics
Associate Fellow - American Institute of Aeronautics and Astronautics (AIAA)
Included in "Who's Who in Science and Engineering" 1993 - 2000
Former Chairman of the Aerospace Control and Guidance Systems
- Committee of the Society of Automotive Engineers
Former Member, AIAA Committee on Society and Aerospace Technology
37 year NASA career

Lt. Colonel Shelton F. Lankford
United States Marine Corps (ret)
A-4 Skyhawk, KC-130 (10,000+ Hours)
S-2, T-1, F9F, F-11, OV-10, T-2J
303 Combat Missions


Captain Paul A. Trood
B737-800/400 Captain
Qantas Airways
Australia
Experience: 18,000 flight hours

Jim Mustanich
ATP 20,000+ hours
Typed in CE-500, DHC-7, EMB-110, BA-3100
Aircraft flown include Boeing 727,737, Douglas DC-9, MD-80
United Air Lines, American International Airlines, Air Pacific Airlines, West Air Airlines
6-7 years corporate flying in Cessna Citations
Factory demo pilot for Cessna Citations

Ted Muga
Naval Aviator - Retired Commander, USNR
A/C experience - Grumman E-1 and E-2 ( Approx, 3800 hours )
Pan American World Airways - Retired Dec. 1991 ( that's when PanAM went bankrupt )
Flight Engineer/First Officer -- Boeing 707 & Boeing 727 ( approx. 7500 hours )

Col Robert Bowman
President of the Institute for Space and Security Studies
Executive Vice President of Millennium III Corporation
retired Presiding Archbishop of the United Catholic Church
101 combat missions in Vietnam
directed all the “Star Wars” programs under Presidents Ford and Carter
recipient of the Eisenhower Medal
George F. Kennan Peace Prize
President’s Medal of Veterans for Peace
Society of Military Engineers' ROTC Award of Merit (twice)
Six Air Medals
Ph.D. is in Aeronautics and Nuclear Engineering from Caltech
chaired 8 major international conferences
one of the country’s foremost experts on National Security
independent candidate for President of the US in 2000
http://thepatriots.us

John Panarelli
friend and fellow aviator of John Ogonowski - Capt. AA #11
ATP: L-300, B-737, DC-10, DC-8, FE, TT=approx. 11,000 hours
USAF-C141-IP, Eastern Metro, Braniff, Ryan International, Emery
Worldwide, Polar Air Cargo

More listed here - http://pilotsfor911truth.org/core


Evidence for those who make excuse for the government story -


Opinion
"Because the govt told me so"
Aircraft Forensic Evidence - N/A

For those who make excuses for the government story -

Please let us know when you find one verified pilot (or precedent) willing to support your claims that a standard Boeing 767 can maintain control and stability at Vmo+150, Va+220 --and pull G's-- out of a 10,000+ foot dive, while rolling on G's cranking into a 38 degree bank, to hit a target with less than a 25' margin for error - for a pilot with less experience than one who couldn't control a 172 at 65 knots. Please let us also know when you have any type of evidence for your argument other than opinion or "Because the govt told me so...".

Founded in August 2006, Pilots For 9/11 Truth is a growing organization of aviation professionals from around the globe. The organization has also analyzed Flight Data provided by the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) for the Pentagon Attack and the events in Shanksville, PA. The data does not support the government story. The NTSB/FBI refuse to comment. Pilots For 9/11 Truth do not offer theory or point blame at this point in time. However, there is a growing mountain of conflicting information and data in which government agencies and officials refuse to acknowledge. Pilots For 9/11 Truth Core member list continues to grow. The need for a new investigation has never been more apparent.

http://pilotsfor911truth.org/core.html for full member list.

http://pilotsfor911truth.org/join to join.
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9/11 Justice Now
post Aug 9 2011, 05:56 AM
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Rob it says error 404 this page cannot be found on the youtube link.

Is this supposed to be a new interview?

Cheers Paul S
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rob balsamo
post Aug 9 2011, 06:22 AM
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QUOTE (9/11 Justice Now @ Aug 9 2011, 06:56 AM) *
Rob it says error 404 this page cannot be found on the youtube link.

Is this supposed to be a new interview?

Cheers Paul S



lol... looks like YT took it down....

This is what i get...

QUOTE
"Impossible Plane Sp..."
This video is no longer available because the YouTube account associated with this video has been terminated due to multiple third-party notifications of copyright infringement from claimants including:

Amazing Discoveries
Amazing Discoveries
Amazing Discoveries

Sorry about that.
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9/11 Justice Now
post Aug 9 2011, 11:21 AM
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QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Aug 9 2011, 09:22 PM) *
lol... looks like YT took it down....

This is what i get...


Do you think it would be possible to post this video somewhere else? Also when did you do this interview?

Cheers Paul

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rob balsamo
post Aug 9 2011, 12:19 PM
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QUOTE (9/11 Justice Now @ Aug 9 2011, 12:21 PM) *
Do you think it would be possible to post this video somewhere else? Also when did you do this interview?

Cheers Paul

thumbsup.gif thumbsup.gif thumbsup.gif



I didnt do the interview. Someone else called Leslie and posted it to YT. Seems that YT deleted their account for copyright violations. My YT account is still very active. I have tried to look for other archives of the interview but it doesnt seem to be posted at any other video hosting site. Although there is plenty of reference to the interview in google searches.
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mrmitosis
post Aug 10 2011, 02:14 AM
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I may have saved a copy of it onto my computer. I'll have a rummage through my hard drive when I get home.

Have you lost the file altogether, Rob? Or just the upload you linked to?

There must be a million versions out there, 911JN. Do a search for "Drunkest Home Videos".
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rob balsamo
post Aug 10 2011, 03:53 PM
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QUOTE (mrmitosis @ Aug 10 2011, 03:14 AM) *
I may have saved a copy of it onto my computer. I'll have a rummage through my hard drive when I get home.

Have you lost the file altogether, Rob? Or just the upload you linked to?

There must be a million versions out there, 911JN. Do a search for "Drunkest Home Videos".


Unfortunately i didn't save it to my hard drive. It's been up on YT for a while, so I didn't think they would take it down.

By the way, nice post over at VT. It confirms what i said in my very first comment. I'd reply there, but why bother when the author of the article is deleting comments.
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Maha Mantra
post Aug 15 2011, 12:00 PM
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Can you get it from 'Amazing Discoveries' ? Is there a way to acknowledge them in a presentation that they would accept ? Just wondering.

The simulator attempts to duplicate hitting the Pentagon are fantastic.

There are usually 757/767 aircraft available out here in Mojave if someone wants to challenge anyone to attempt to duplicate the Government story. It might be pricey and fatal, but maybe some rich believer might take up the challenge. 'Myth Busters' !

Does the military have any type of testing or instruction regarding the flight of the 767 tankers ?

Who does the actual testing of the airframes ? Independent contractors, or Boeing ?
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rob balsamo
post Aug 15 2011, 05:07 PM
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We found the video and cut it down to the call with Leslie Hazzard.




I've also updated the original article.
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questionitall
post Aug 15 2011, 09:49 PM
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QUOTE (rob balsamo @ Aug 15 2011, 06:07 PM) *
We found the video and cut it down to the call with Leslie Hazzard.

<iframe width="425" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/9ZHamfG1aII" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


I've also updated the original article.



Great work Rob...very informative and incentive for me to keep ferreting out proof for why a Boeing 767-200 couldn't possibly have impacted World Trade Center 2. Keep it up.
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Aldo Marquis CIT
post Aug 15 2011, 11:58 PM
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You mean a stock 767-200 that was alleged to be UA175 right?

Because a 767 airliner sized plane did hit wtc2 and I don't think PFT promotes otherwise.
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9/11 Justice Now
post Aug 25 2011, 04:29 AM
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QUOTE (Aldo Marquis CIT @ Aug 16 2011, 02:58 PM) *
You mean a stock 767-200 that was alleged to be UA175 right?

Because a 767 airliner sized plane did hit wtc2 and I don't think PFT promotes otherwise.


Thanks for posting the video again Rob, hopefully sometime soon we will get a smoking gun
but that even in itself is wishful thinking, if we dont find the truth soon and fast all hope is going
to slip away we are approaching the tenth year mark and this makes me very excited and nerveous
at the same time, i just wish i had more money and could find a proper job so i could send out as
many FOIA requests for information as humanly possible, becasue now more than ever we need
new information which will hopefully bring new evidence to light. The more information we get
regarding the events that day the more chance we have of answering unanswered questions which
the government has stubbornly refused to answer and we all know why they will not answer us
and continue to ignore us, that part is very obvious.

The people who carried out this horrendous criminal act must be stopped and they must be prevented
from doing any more harm, we must find a way to stop them using all legal and necissary means possible,
i am getting very tired of not knowing the whole story and i want answers NOW, why is it that everytime
i look into 911 i always find questions that i cant find answers too? It seems the more i read about 911, the
more i learn the more suspicious and curious i become. I have read new information that is just coming out
and which has just come out, and let me tell you this, the coincidences are growing if you add them all together
you will end up with a ridiculously long pile of 911 coincidences, but are they just coincides one might ask?
There are certain people who will tell us so, there are certain people who wish to remain ignorant to the truth
and wish to just plug their ear and sing la la la la la and hand wave the evidence away because i does not fit
into their tiny little protective bubble of denial which they continue to live in and continue to use to shield themselves
from the very truth surrounding the events of september the elleventh.

But enough for now i better stop carrying on.

Cheers Paul S

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