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United 93 Csv File Download

rob balsamo
post Apr 12 2007, 08:23 PM
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Edit to Add: Dec 17, 2007 UA93 CSV Files


We are now in possession of above files. We are currently analyzing the same. So far from what i have seen, it doesnt look good for the govt story (as usual), nor does it look too good for those who make the excuse that altimeter lag was a factor on a 757 flying 'outside the envelope'.

Just a tease for now... more information will be forthcoming...

Cover letter page 1 of many....



Jan 15, 2008 edit to add:


This post has been edited by rob balsamo: Mar 15 2008, 08:19 AM
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MichaelMR
post Apr 12 2007, 08:39 PM
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This is great news Rob. Can't wait for the rest. cheers.gif
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behind
post Apr 12 2007, 09:10 PM
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Same here!

smile.gif
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AZ/Watch
post Apr 12 2007, 10:16 PM
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bump

This post has been edited by AZ/Watch: Apr 13 2007, 12:09 AM
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Terrorcell
post Apr 12 2007, 11:24 PM
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QUOTE (johndoeX @ Apr 12 2007, 07:23 PM)
We are now in possession of above files. We are currently analyzing the same. So far from what i have seen, it doesnt look good for the govt story (as usual), nor does it look too good for those who make the excuse that altimeter lag was a factor on a 757 flying 'outside the envelope'.

Somehow I knew you were going to say that! wink.gif
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LizzyTish
post Apr 13 2007, 09:28 AM
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QUOTE (johndoeX @ Apr 12 2007, 07:23 PM)
altimeter lag was a factor on a 757 flying 'outside the envelope'.

Could you translate that for those of us who don't speak 'pilot'? blink.gif
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amazed!
post Apr 13 2007, 09:53 AM
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Yeah Rob, keep up the good work. cheers.gif
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rob balsamo
post Apr 14 2007, 08:06 PM
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chek
post Apr 14 2007, 08:12 PM
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Is it possible to tell at this stage how much (if any) of the recorded flight time is present and correct/missing/suspect?
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UnderTow
post Apr 14 2007, 09:22 PM
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Remember again, there are TWO distinct seperate data sets here.
One is the animated representation, the other is the text CSV read out.
So it's important to always denote which you are talking/asking about, if not both. smile.gif

In the CSV, Two sensors stop recording at 2 minutes and 3 minutes before the end of time in the readout file.

One has to do with the internal plumbing, and the other with a control surface (aileron to be exact there).

It is extremely suspect. There is a lot to go over though, but so far it doesn't look good (again) for the official story in my opinion.

Others have told me to calm down, so that's what I'm trying to do. biggrin.gif

Thanks very much to everyone.
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rob balsamo
post Dec 17 2007, 12:32 PM
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added csv file download to original post...
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dMz
post Dec 17 2007, 06:51 PM
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Excellent!

Is there a timestamp "offset" that needs to be accounted for in the UA93 data? I heard that there is a ~24 second discrepancy in the AA77 FDR and RADES data from what Tume told me.

Thanks again Rob! cheers.gif
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UnderTow
post Dec 17 2007, 11:26 PM
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QUOTE (dMole @ Dec 17 2007, 05:51 PM)
I heard that there is a ~24 second discrepancy in the AA77 FDR and RADES data from what Tume told me.

Haha. The Farmer strikes at common knowledge with his Final Mystery.

I would not worry about that 'discrepancy' at the moment.
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dMz
post Dec 17 2007, 11:51 PM
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Thanks UT for the clarification.

To avoid any aspersions being cast against Tume, let me clarify that Tume was merely informing me of a potential pitfall based upon the information that the Farmer had provided to Tume, I believe. Obviously, 25 seconds at aircraft speeds can make some HUGE differences in position and collisions...

So is it reasonable then to proceed with the AA77 and UA93 FDR data "as is" similar to GPS timestamps? vacuum.gif
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rob balsamo
post Dec 18 2007, 12:24 AM
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dmole,

The NTSB plotted AA77 one second away from the pentagon wall. The DME data confirms it.


The NTSB plotted the UA93 data within feet of ground elevation at impact. The altimeter confirms it, which by the way, crushes those who use the altimeter lag argument for AA77 being 400 feet too high considering UA93 rate of descent was almost 6 times as much at impact... according to the data.

The "25 seconds" difference doesnt matter much when we can confirm position based on the data. The "6 seconds missing" argument is complete hogwash based on what i have described above.
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dMz
post Jan 13 2008, 07:58 AM
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For anyone investigating the FDR data allegedly from UA93's crash site- a word of caution on timestamps.

I have found 3 different data sampling rates in the 4 .CSV files in "ua93tab.zip". The "A to E" and "M to T" data files were apparently sampled at 2 Hz (or 2 times per second, or 0.50 second intervals). The "F to L" data file was sampled at 4 Hz (or 0.25 second intervals). Finally, the "U to Z" data file was sampled at 8 Hz (or 0.125 second intervals).

This could create some minor hassle when trying to graph data columns from different timebases/data files, but there is a relatively easy work-around in MS Excel using time addition and conversion functions.

It appears to have been a peculiarly "wild" ride from my early investigations of this data set.
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rob balsamo
post Jan 13 2008, 08:11 AM
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Different parameters have different sampling rates. I dont think its exclusive to file creation.

For instance, Altitude recording is 1hz, while pitch/roll angles are 4hz and G loads are 8hz (IIRC).

Hope this helps...
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stuarthwyman
post Jan 17 2008, 06:07 PM
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I post the same question on the other topic too biggrin.gif

Hi, great forum this!!!

I was looking for a topic like this.

About the CVR of the UA93.

First:

I. THE COCKPIT RECORDINGS OF FLIGHT 93

What the family members heard:
On April 18, 2002 family members were finally allowed to listen to the cockpit voice recorder. “The FBI initially declined to play the tape, saying it was too disturbing, and it was evidence that might be used in criminal prosecutions related to the attacks of September 11.” (Among the Heroes, p. 374). The family members were “forbidden from recording the tape or from taking notes” (p. 375).

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discu...dress=125x37066

Second:

9/11 commission report says:

UA175: CVR Destroyed
AA11: CVR Destroyed
AA77: CVR Found but "Not Readable"
UA93: CVR found/Readable


for the UA93,
I would like to know:
How much was readable the CVR?
Is it possibe that somebody had manipulated it?
Can you tell with sureness that the CVR data recording is 100% correct?
Is it possible to have the timeline of what the UA93 CVR says?

thank you very much

This post has been edited by stuarthwyman: Jan 17 2008, 06:11 PM
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wstutt
post Jan 25 2008, 02:13 AM
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QUOTE (johndoeX @ Apr 12 2007, 07:23 PM)
Edit to Add: Dec 17, 2007 UA93 CSV Files

<snip>

I just noticed that the CSV files mentioned above (the first message in this topic) are comma quote delimited whereas the CSV files from the CD provided by the NTSB available here mentioned in this topic which have identical contents to the CSV files on the CD available here are comma delimited without the quotes around the text values.

I have not checked to see whether there are any more important differences.

Regards,
Warren.
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rob balsamo
post Jan 25 2008, 02:38 AM
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Not sure what that means as im not an excel expert... but ok.

Either way, the files available here are directly from the NTSB via the FOIA, sent to yours truly... cover letter is included in original post.
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