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"navy Atc" Controlled Fighters At Langley, Otis?

andrewkornkven
post Jul 28 2007, 06:04 PM
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It's always been my theory that there was never any stand down "order" from any high official like Bush, Cheney or Rumsfeld. I believe instead that the stand down was orchestrated from outside, by a group that was able to infiltrate only one level of the communication structure of the air defense system, and thus be able to muck up the scramble orders discreetly, and thereby insure no fighters were actually put in a position to stop the hijacked planes from reaching their targets.

With this approach, and after reading, and rereading, the first chapter of David Ray Griffin's (and Robin Hordon's) latest book, my suspicions naturally fell upon Major Kevin Nasypany, the crew commander for NEADS who issued the botched scramble orders to the fighters off Langley and Otis air force bases. However, after looking at his picture, I have to concede that he certainly doesn't look like a traitor.

I had been under the impression that Nasypany had issued the orders himself directly to the pilots in the fighter planes at Otis and Langley. But after reading through a post from our good friend Gumboot at J-REF, I noticed that there was yet another layer of communication between Nasypany at NEADS and the men in the cockpits. Gumboot had mentioned the clearances being issued by "Navy ATC."

Does anyone have any information on who these Navy controllers were who issued the now obviously absurd clearances to the pilots of the fighter planes being scrambled? What are their names, and where were they based?

QUOTE
At NEADS, Staff Sergeant William Huckabone is the first to notice on his radar scope that the three fighters launched from Langley Air Force Base are off course. Reportedly, they have headed east into a military training airspace over the ocean, instead of north toward the Baltimore area as instructed (see (9:30 a.m.-9:37 a.m.) September 11, 2001). Along with Master Sergeant Steve Citino, another controller who is sitting next to him, Huckabone orders a Navy air traffic controller who is handling the fighters to get them turned around. The Navy controller appears not to understand the urgency of the situation. He responds, “You’ve got [the fighters] moving east in airspace. Now you want ‘em to go to Baltimore?” Huckabone replies yes, and says, “Have him contact us on auxiliary frequency 2-3-4 decimal 6. Instead of taking handoffs to us and us handing ‘em back, just tell Center they’ve got to go to Baltimore.” The Navy controller says, “Stand by. We’ll get back to you.” Citino retorts, “What do you mean, ‘We’ll get back to you’? Just do it!” Huckabone jokes, “I’m gonna choke that guy!” [Vanity Fair, 8/1/2006]
http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/searchR...ch=on&search=Go


Maybe I've missed something, but has anyone ever found out who the "that guy"is that Huckabone wanted to choke?

This line of questioning is even more intriguing as it turns out that the "Navy ATC" who controlled fighters to be scrambled were in one way or another controlled by the Navy Command Center located in the southwest face of the Pentagon building-- which just happened to be wiped out by AAL77! (or by whatever)

Here's more information on the Navy Command Center that was housed in the Pentagon:

QUOTE
Personnel in the Navy Command Center at the Pentagon, which is located on the first floor of the building’s southwest face, learn of the attack on the WTC from television reports. The center is tasked with constantly monitoring global current events and also monitoring the latest status of all US Naval assets around the world. Its employees have to keep Navy leaders in Washington up to date on what is happening in the world as it directly relates to Navy operations and other security or military issues. Admiral Timothy Keating, who is the Navy’s director of operations in the Pentagon, describes it as a “nerve center.” Forty to 50 people man it constantly, 24 hours every day. Located within the center is the Chief of Naval Operations Intelligence Plot (CNO-IP), a small, highly secretive intelligence unit that constantly monitors geopolitical developments and military movements that could threaten American forces. The Navy Command Center has just been renovated, and its dozens of employees have been moving in during the past month. ......

All 30 people in the Command Center’s main room watch the footage of the WTC on the large televisions there, whispering to each other, “Think it’s an accident?” [Virginian-Pilot, 9/7/2002] However, according to the Washington Post, “A few old hands muttered to themselves that the Pentagon was probably next.” [Washington Post, 9/16/2001] According to one officer, it is only when the second plane hits the WTC that there will be an “almost instantaneous recognition” that this is a terrorist attack. [Daily Telegraph, 9/11/2002] By that time, Keating will have gone back to his office. He too supposedly only realizes this is an attack when he sees television showing the second crash. [American Forces Press Service, 9/11/2006] Much of the Navy Command Center will be destroyed when the Pentagon is hit at 9:37 a.m. Forty-two of the 50 people working in it will be killed.
ibid. 


Apparently this Command Center, and the "highly secretive" intelligence unit housed within it (the CNO-IP), had some sort of direct control over the scrambling of fighters for the nation's air defense:

QUOTE
Edward Earhart, Matthew Flocco, and their supervisor Lt. Nancy McKeown are inside the Pentagon, watching the televised footage of the burning World Trade Center. They belong to a small meteorological unit based in the Navy Command Center, located on the first floor of the building’s southwest face. McKeown asks her two young aides to bring up New York on the computer because the Command Center is going to send some fighter jets there, in case there is another attack on the city. She orders them to program weather updates for military aircraft converging on New York. However, very soon after this, the Command Center is directly impacted when the Pentagon is hit, and both Flocco and Earhart are killed. [Washington Post, 9/16/2001; Reader's Digest, 9/2002; CNN, 9/8/2002; Newsday, 4/12/2006] Ronald Vauk, the watch commander in the Navy Command Center, is on the phone trying to get more fighters scrambled at the time the Pentagon is hit, though news reports say he wants them to protect Washington, not New York....
ibid.


QUOTE
Lhuillier then interrupts a meeting between Commander Dan Shanower, who is in charge of the CNO-IP, and six others, to tell them about this third plane. Commander David Radi, an aide to Admiral William Fallon, the vice chief of naval operations, is in his Pentagon office about 100 yards from the CNO-IP. He has also heard fragmentary reports about another hijacked plane heading towards Washington, and that fighter jets are being scrambled. He calls the CNO-IP for more information, but is only told, “We’re working on it.”
ibid.


The obvious questions are these: Again, who were the Navy controllers who issued the clearances to the fighters? What is their story? Where were they located, and under whose command were they? What is their relationship with the ill-fated Navy Command Center in the southwest face of the Pentagon, and with the "highly secretive" intelligence unit within it?

Until we answer these questions, we can speculate that Navy ATC may have been the link in the communication chain infiltrated by the conspirators. We have to wonder if it was really a Navy controller issuing the absurd clearances, or an imposter. We also have to wonder what the loyal people in the Command Center that day would have told of the day's events, if they had not been killed.

Anyone have any information or comments? Robin?

This post has been edited by andrewkornkven: Jul 28 2007, 07:58 PM
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Robin Hordon
post Aug 5 2007, 02:16 PM
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Robin Hordon checking in...

First, thank you Andy for your work, and more so, thank you for getting off that "compromized" website and its HI PERP hacks who wish only that legitimate people join them in their "special" gutter. From what I have read, they are disinfo guys who are VERY skilled and detailed at how they are "revising history" to protect us from the truth.

There are but a few points that I will submit...the first is shop talk between me and a high ranked retired Navy guy.

The second is how I see that NORAD was stood down well before 9/11.

For those many folks reading this, I have sent the presentation that I made at the Vancover, BC 9/11 Truth Convention to both Rob Balsamo in hopes that he will let the inside gang take a look at it [no response yet-he's really busy], and I have just sent it to Andy for his review. I am willing to post it up here but the gang needs to be comfortable about it.

Navy...it came as absolutely no surprise to me that the portion of the Pentagon that got hit was Naval Intelligence. I had been personally informed that the Navy Intel was the best in the government and that they were rather independent...as all of the four branches are...but the Navy more so. So, when Andy dug this info out, which shows me that the Navy had ITS OWN CAPABILITY to scramble and take care of business, that cemented the "Pentgon targeting" for me. I see a pattern of "pre-planned targets" which serve the HI PERPS and their "money people" very, very well.

I believe that some of the records about the two trillion in "unaccounted for Penatgon expenditures" were in that part of the Pentagon. It makes for a convincing case that WTC7 "had" to come down because if one considers the building's contents...SEC files, CIA files and other information about investigations into the HI PERP'S narrow band of wealthy friends, one can see the benefits of THOSE files to be destroyed also. And now, to have a "possible" independent military force outside of NORAD to be able to respond to defend DC, well...that'squite interesting.

One thing to always keep in mind are that the "plans" that were made about these four [and possibly more] aircraft called for them to all take off at about the same time, and all crash into their targets at nearly the same time thus providing a ready excuse for NORAD etc. AA77 was 14 minutes-ish late and may have travelled farther westbound than initially intended before turning to the south west, descending and then shortly dropping out of radar contact [a point that "pilots" does not point out in its work on AA77's "alleged" FDR and animation]. And we all know that UA93 was 40-ish minutes late and my belief is that this REALLY screwed up the HI PERP'S plans for a smooth running false-flag attack...and, this lateness may end up being found out to be the reason that UA93 was shot down..if it indeed was. Had AA77 been on time and perhaps on its planned shorter flight path...then the Pentagon would have been struck earlier thus disabling the Naval scramble capabilities early on.

Therefore, if I were enginering this attack..I'd disembowel the Navy's defense capabilities for the reasons stated above.

And, in finishing up with the Navy, since the Bush Regime is so out of touch, I find it very interesting that its now Navy personnel in charge of the Iraq occupation and our military "posturing" over in the middle east. HMMMM?

A very brief synopsis of my "view" of how NORAD was stood down on 9/11...

The name of my presentation in Vancouver is:

Its The Civilians Stupid: An Air Traffic Controller's View of the "Institutional Standown" of NORAD Interceptors on 9/11/2001.

Basically, Rumsfeld's Military knew that they had to do something about the normal functioning of the nation's air defenses to allow airliners to hit their targets as soon as the Bush Regime took office. So, they began to make plans on how to get into a "wartime footing" in the middle east...eventually getting to occupy Iraq...one of its primary goals from BEFORE the election. [FYI...one of my close friends in Boston HEARD GWB make this claim in a campagn speech during the primaries in Boston] and part of those plans showed that normal airline screening security and NORAD had to be handcuffed. So, they put a military general in charge of FAA Airline Security [Canavan], and I postulate that HE helped grease the skids for the June change in heiarchal communications and "approval" for handling "hijackings" between the FAA and now the Joint Cheifs of Staff.

The way I see it, because I have been there and done that regarding being involved in joint FAA-Military operational changes, the "changed but actually only relocated" protocols had the net effect of having all scrambles, in flight emergency, and hijack scrambles, use the same protocol used for hijackings. The hijacking scramble protocol needs pentagon approval, and the "in-flight emergency scramble protocol does not...its direct from FAA to the appropriate NORAD-Defense Sector [NEADS] air base that is on call.

Consequently, the only thing that had to happen on 9/11 was that ALL references to the airbourne events needed to be referred to as "hijackings"...and this was accomplished in a variety of ways. In the end, when the FAA's Scoggins stated that they needed some fighters up there, that is an order from the FAA directly to the military for the military to provide assistance. The order was given directly TO the appropriate NEADS personnel...and it was ignored...everything was shifted into the "hijacking mindset".

Andy's focus upon Nasypany is well placed, BUT...this is why the "war games" were scheduled that day, or during that time period. Nasypany MAY have been thinking HIGHJACK-HIJACK-HIJACK only...however, the way the heiarchy works is that when the FAA speaks for emergencies, the military DOES, and does so immediately.

This was not done...and indeed Nasypany is right at those crossroads.

If anyone is interested in seeing my presentation in Vancouver, you can get copies at the 911TV website [Ken Jenkins]. Chances are fairly good that Rob and the gang won't post this because he knows that I have such HUGE concerns about P4T being used by the HI PERPS to further establish their lies as put forth by AA77's FDR and animation that is definitely doctored.

The orginal track over the ground for AA77, as shown in the NTSB's own radar records' appendices, and ALL early news reports and data, shows that AA77 made a strange right-left-left-right turn several minutes before it began its left turn AND that AA77 BEGAN TO DESCEND immediately before it was lost to radar identification. If one looks at the FDR and animation, there are neither the earlier "r-l-l-r jog" in the westbound flight path, nor is there any indication that AA77 began to DESCEND. BOTH of these are well established facts. P4T chose only to look at the fraudulence AT the Pentagon, and the ONLY way that there is even any mention that AA77 was lost to positive radar identification on the DVDs is because I raised holy hell with Rob. And now, I see that the Callum fellow is doing the HI PERP'S work for them in covering over the same "radar not lost" dis-info.

Anyway, thanks Andy...

Love, Peace, Progress, Clean Elections with PAPER BALLOTS

Robin Hordon
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Robin Hordon
post Aug 5 2007, 02:17 PM
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Just writing to get replies...

Hordon
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amazed!
post Aug 11 2007, 03:20 PM
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Fascinating stuff here guys, thanks.

I've read elsewhere, can't remember where, that indeed the auditors looking for Dov's Dollars were working in that part of the Pentagon, and that it was sometimes called the "catcher's mitt".
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andrewkornkven
post Aug 11 2007, 05:44 PM
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Robin,

First, let me tell you I was unable to open the attachments you sent me-- the Vancouver Presentation and the Peace Movement talk. I'm not too handy with computer stuff, so please, post it here on Pilots for Truth. I'm sure everyone, including Rob, would appreciate it.

Regarding the J-REF forum. I think you are mistaken. I think it's a good idea to post there, and I will continue to do so. The greatest danger to the truth movement is not a bunch of slick shills, it is silence. The worst thing that could happen to us is that people would stop talking about 9/11. Therefore, any discussion of the events benefits us, and anyone who hosts a forum on the topic is our ally.

As far as I can tell, the Randi forum is the one place on the internet where the nuts and bolts are discussed. Sure the forum is predominated by people who are hostile the message of truth; but, let's face it, that's the way it is in the real world. I don't care what any poll says, I know the vast majority of my fellow Americans more or less believe the official story. Yes, some of the more prominent posters on there are slick operators who are in the business of buttressing the Official Lie; there are others, though, who I think are are honest, sincere people who just happen to have been sucked into a good-sounding lie-- mostly because the "official truth movement" has not yet provided them with a coherent explanation of the events of that day. And also remember, for every poster there, there are maybe five or six, or maybe ten or twelve, visitors to the website who don't have a firm opinion on the issue. It is to this audience that we ought to direct our messages when we post on a forum like Randi

As for the forum itself, I have no complaints. I've been allowed to say whatever I want to say for a couple hundred posts now, without even one being deleted or edited.

We have to be conscious of how persuasive a defender of the official story sounds if he has done his homework and studied the absurd details of the official story intensively. To the average person curious about 9/11 arguments and visiting the site for the first time, a well-versed shill sounds like a true expert. It is absolutely necessary that those of us versed in the technical details of the various aspects of 9/11 show up to confront these people on their own turf, and beat them at their own game. If we don't, we will lose the war and it will be our own fault.

An example of this is the recent cameo appearance of Boston controller "Cheap Shot." I tried to expose him for what he is, and isn't. It would have been even better, Robin, if you would have logged in to contend with him as well. Remember, you don't have lower yourself to bicker with the idiots who make up the majority on that site (and most other internet sites as well.) You can just take the high ground, and make principled arguments, and ignore the rabble. That's what I try to do, though I don't always succeed.

Regarding your idea of how the stand down was accomplished, I guess I can only say I can't believe it would have been that simple. I can't believe they would have been confident enough that simply changing the protocols would assure their plans to be allowed to carry through. I have to suspect that someone had more of a "hands on" control of what the fighters in the system were doing. It is seeming more and more mysterious who exactly it was that was issuing the direct orders to the pilots in their cockpits:

QUOTE
(8:46 a.m.): Fighters Ordered to Scramble to Flight 11 Nine Minutes after NORAD Notification
Edit event 

Two F-15 fighters are ordered to scramble from Otis Air National Guard Base in Massachusetts to find Flight 11, approximately 190 miles from the known location of the plane and 188 miles from New York City. [Channel 4 News (London), 9/13/2001; Washington Post, 9/15/2001; CNN, 9/17/2001; Los Angeles Times, 9/17/2001; North American Aerospace Defense Command, 9/18/2001; 9/11 Commission, 6/17/2004] On the NEADS operations floor Major Kevin Nasypany instructed Major James Fox, the leader of the Weapons Team, to launch the Otis fighters a minute earlier, at 8:45 a.m. [Vanity Fair, 8/1/2006] Interestingly, the 9/11 Commission will later state that “Because of a technical issue, there are no NEADS recordings available of the NEADS senior weapons director and weapons director technician position responsible for controlling the Otis scramble.” [9/11 Commission, 7/24/2004, pp. 459] According to the commission, NORAD makes the decision to scramble after only one phone call, as the decision is made to act first and get clearances later. Yet there is a nine-minute gap between when the 9/11 Commission says NORAD is notified about the hijacking at 8:37 a.m., and when the fighters are ordered scrambled. This delay has not been explained. The pilots had already received several unofficial warnings before this order—possibly as early as 8:34 a.m., 12 minutes earlier. One of the pilots recalls sitting in the cockpit, ready and waiting for the scramble order to come. [BBC, 9/1/2002; 9/11 Commission, 6/17/2004] According to some reports, the Otis fighters only take off six minutes after the scramble order, at 8:52 a.m. [North American Aerospace Defense Command, 9/18/2001; 9/11 Commission, 6/17/2004]


I'd sure like to know what that "technical issue" was.
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Robin Hordon
post Aug 11 2007, 11:33 PM
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Andy,

Thanks for your response here...a few points...

First, there is a group of folk with the highest levels of integrity and competency ready and willing for your input. This Randi or whatever group resides in the gutter, and is manned by folks who only know how to function within that gutter. This is something that you are yet to realize because you have not been involved with the gang that I'm hanging with out here. Scientists, Doctors and the like...

Second, you have NO IDEA how much I have already been involved with Scoggins at ZBW...and it was done with the cover of Dr. David Ray Griffin who worked the middle of a three way conversation where one of the three, Scoggins, thought it was a two way conversation. There are MANY othet elements of this three way conversation that Griffin DID NOT USE in his book...and we have agreed to keep such information out of the public eye for a variety of very, very valid reasons.

So, my "responses" to Scoggins are deftly pesented in Griffin's new book: Debunking 9/11 Debunking..." Griffin was BRILLIANT in his getting more info out than you, and in some instances, even I know. Griffin is deeply concerned about Scoggins being fired. BUT...I have told him that this is unlikely because of a varity of reasons, one of which is that the FAA personnel are slowly sensing being set up as "patsies" in the truest sense, and another is that there are a whole bunch of GOOD PATRIOTS within the FAA that may soon be letting loose with some inside info. Controllers do not like being TOLD what to do, nor to have their integrity challenged. Keeping mum will last only so long...and once the Bush Regime and its Congressional whores are pushed away, I expect more and more info to come out.

Regarding the "technical issues"...let me share my postulation...

Dawn Deskins stated early on that she got info about troubles in the sky around 08:30...Duffy [I think] noted the SAME about his FIRST notification at OTIS AFB...again AT....Otis AFB. This means that the info was in the pipeline sooner than 08:30 does it not?

So, I believe that Zalewski, or some other controller in surrounig sectors, or EVEN at ALB approach, may have reached out to NEADS even EARLIER THAN THAT. The first calls to NEADS from ZBW's TMU came a few minutes BEFORE 08:30 and were accomplished by the fellow manning the TMU before Scoggins arrived. Additionally, Scoggins stated that he made over 40 calls to NEADS...yet we have only a few acknowledged by Bronner in Vanity Fair...and they ALL started later than 08:28 or so.

My best guess is that the "technical issue" involved is that NEADS got the first call to scramble BEFORE 08:27...and NOT at 08:37 as current folklore...aka...The 9/11 Commission Report...has it laid out.

Its important to remember that the commissioners KNEW that they were being lied to about all sorts of things in the military's THREE different timelines...so...WHY should we think that it WASN'T about the REAL times of the first calls for scrambles?

Is THAT enough of a "technical issue" for you?

[smile here...its my Boston wise-ass coming out-no offense intended...Balsamo will get it...]

It's even POSSIBLE that someone gave NEADS a holler at 08:17-ish about AA11 being in deep trouble. Laura Brown AND another private FAA source known to Griffin BOTH state that the FIRST FAA-HERNDON-PENTAGON phone banks were started between 08:20 and 08:25...PHONE BANKS!!!! Well, if THAT was the case Andy, what time would the FIRST reach-out by Zalewski been to START these phone banks? Its GOTTA be before 08:20 or before 08:25!!!

So, maybe NOW its enough of a "technical issue" to you... [BWA again..sorry]

And then, begging this question from a different angle, what IF...IF...IF...the "technical issue" was that it was an audio tape that showed that NEADS had been notified around 08:20 +/-...?

Game-Set-Match...Rummie's NORAD and Pentagon were "in on it".

Andy, I have transcribed tapes myself...many times...its EASY to change the "written" version mistaking/changing a "1" to a "2", or to a "3"...[08:17 becomes 08:27 which becomes 08:37 etc] and in this modern era, cannot we believe that IF the Pentagon or FBI wanted to change the electronically implanted "time tracks" on the recorded tapes, that they could do so?

So, is it NOW enough to at least consider the "techinical issue" as Hamilton and Zelikow saving the ush Regime...and the Pentagon budget? [BWA strikes again..but I still have PASSION...]

Andy, chances are that they were just about to "technically" get caught!

Excellent time for a "technical issue" to show up aye!

Regarding my presentation...I think that we have figured a way to get it out to the gang in an email format...or something.

I suspect that you might be surprised at how easily I think they pulled the "stand-down" off right in front of everyone's noses. And THEN...they had 2-3 months to "test it's effectiveness" beginning in June and lasting until 9/11 when NO scrambles of any kind were recorded!!!!

Sometimes the facts may be just sitting right there on on the kitchen table...

These guys are cooked because we have them TOTALLY SURROUNDED with implicating facts about their involvement in the most heinous atrocity ever pulled off in this nation's history...they know it...they are stonewalling their stonewalls.

The Bush Crime Family et al, cannot WAIT to get out of town...which is why I do not want to impeach...I'm thinking Nuremburg all the way...

So here's a nice segue' from my emotions...

Love, Peace, Progress with Clean Elections and PAPER BALLOTS

Robin Hordon
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painter
post Aug 12 2007, 01:48 AM
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Thank you for giving me hope, Mr. Hordon. I've had so little for so long.
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Robin Hordon
post Aug 12 2007, 03:09 AM
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Painter...

Trust what's IN YOU!

What's in there is far more worthy than out current leaders...you will see...

Hordon
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painter
post Aug 12 2007, 03:12 AM
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QUOTE (Robin Hordon @ Aug 11 2007, 11:09 PM)
Painter...

Trust what's IN YOU!

What's in there is far more worthy than out current leaders...you will see...

Hordon

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amazed!
post Aug 14 2007, 05:10 PM
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I don't understand why Sea Lord was not controlling navy aircraft that day?
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JackD
post Oct 17 2007, 09:20 PM
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QUOTE (andrewkornkven @ Jul 28 2007, 05:04 PM)
It's always been my theory that there was never any stand down "order" from any high official like Bush, Cheney or Rumsfeld. I believe instead that the stand down was orchestrated from outside, by a group that was able to infiltrate only one level of the communication structure of the air defense system, and thus be able to muck up the scramble orders discreetly, and thereby insure no fighters were actually put in a position to stop the hijacked planes from reaching their targets.

With this approach, and after reading, and rereading, the first chapter of David Ray Griffin's (and Robin Hordon's) latest book, my suspicions naturally fell upon Major Kevin Nasypany, the crew commander for NEADS who issued the botched scramble orders to the fighters off Langley and Otis air force bases. However, after looking at his picture, I have to concede that he certainly doesn't look like a traitor.

I had been under the impression that Nasypany had issued the orders himself directly to the pilots in the fighter planes at Otis and Langley. But after reading through a post from our good friend Gumboot at J-REF, I noticed that there was yet another layer of communication between Nasypany at NEADS and the men in the cockpits. Gumboot had mentioned the clearances being issued by "Navy ATC."

Does anyone have any information on who these Navy controllers were who issued the now obviously absurd clearances to the pilots of the fighter planes being scrambled? What are their names, and where were they based?

QUOTE
At NEADS, Staff Sergeant William Huckabone is the first to notice on his radar scope that the three fighters launched from Langley Air Force Base are off course. Reportedly, they have headed east into a military training airspace over the ocean, instead of north toward the Baltimore area as instructed (see (9:30 a.m.-9:37 a.m.) September 11, 2001). Along with Master Sergeant Steve Citino, another controller who is sitting next to him, Huckabone orders a Navy air traffic controller who is handling the fighters to get them turned around. The Navy controller appears not to understand the urgency of the situation. He responds, “You’ve got [the fighters] moving east in airspace. Now you want ‘em to go to Baltimore?” Huckabone replies yes, and says, “Have him contact us on auxiliary frequency 2-3-4 decimal 6. Instead of taking handoffs to us and us handing ‘em back, just tell Center they’ve got to go to Baltimore.” The Navy controller says, “Stand by. We’ll get back to you.” Citino retorts, “What do you mean, ‘We’ll get back to you’? Just do it!” Huckabone jokes, “I’m gonna choke that guy!” [Vanity Fair, 8/1/2006]
http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/searchR...ch=on&search=Go


Maybe I've missed something, but has anyone ever found out who the "that guy"is that Huckabone wanted to choke?

This line of questioning is even more intriguing as it turns out that the "Navy ATC" who controlled fighters to be scrambled were in one way or another controlled by the Navy Command Center located in the southwest face of the Pentagon building-- which just happened to be wiped out by AAL77! (or by whatever)

Here's more information on the Navy Command Center that was housed in the Pentagon:

QUOTE
Personnel in the Navy Command Center at the Pentagon, which is located on the first floor of the building’s southwest face, learn of the attack on the WTC from television reports. The center is tasked with constantly monitoring global current events and also monitoring the latest status of all US Naval assets around the world. Its employees have to keep Navy leaders in Washington up to date on what is happening in the world as it directly relates to Navy operations and other security or military issues. Admiral Timothy Keating, who is the Navy’s director of operations in the Pentagon, describes it as a “nerve center.” Forty to 50 people man it constantly, 24 hours every day. Located within the center is the Chief of Naval Operations Intelligence Plot (CNO-IP), a small, highly secretive intelligence unit that constantly monitors geopolitical developments and military movements that could threaten American forces. The Navy Command Center has just been renovated, and its dozens of employees have been moving in during the past month. ......

All 30 people in the Command Center’s main room watch the footage of the WTC on the large televisions there, whispering to each other, “Think it’s an accident?” [Virginian-Pilot, 9/7/2002] However, according to the Washington Post, “A few old hands muttered to themselves that the Pentagon was probably next.” [Washington Post, 9/16/2001] According to one officer, it is only when the second plane hits the WTC that there will be an “almost instantaneous recognition” that this is a terrorist attack. [Daily Telegraph, 9/11/2002] By that time, Keating will have gone back to his office. He too supposedly only realizes this is an attack when he sees television showing the second crash. [American Forces Press Service, 9/11/2006] Much of the Navy Command Center will be destroyed when the Pentagon is hit at 9:37 a.m. Forty-two of the 50 people working in it will be killed.
ibid.  


Apparently this Command Center, and the "highly secretive" intelligence unit housed within it (the CNO-IP), had some sort of direct control over the scrambling of fighters for the nation's air defense:

QUOTE
Edward Earhart, Matthew Flocco, and their supervisor Lt. Nancy McKeown are inside the Pentagon, watching the televised footage of the burning World Trade Center. They belong to a small meteorological unit based in the Navy Command Center, located on the first floor of the building’s southwest face. McKeown asks her two young aides to bring up New York on the computer because the Command Center is going to send some fighter jets there, in case there is another attack on the city. She orders them to program weather updates for military aircraft converging on New York. However, very soon after this, the Command Center is directly impacted when the Pentagon is hit, and both Flocco and Earhart are killed. [Washington Post, 9/16/2001; Reader's Digest, 9/2002; CNN, 9/8/2002; Newsday, 4/12/2006] Ronald Vauk, the watch commander in the Navy Command Center, is on the phone trying to get more fighters scrambled at the time the Pentagon is hit, though news reports say he wants them to protect Washington, not New York....
ibid.


QUOTE
Lhuillier then interrupts a meeting between Commander Dan Shanower, who is in charge of the CNO-IP, and six others, to tell them about this third plane. Commander David Radi, an aide to Admiral William Fallon, the vice chief of naval operations, is in his Pentagon office about 100 yards from the CNO-IP. He has also heard fragmentary reports about another hijacked plane heading towards Washington, and that fighter jets are being scrambled. He calls the CNO-IP for more information, but is only told, “We’re working on it.”
ibid.


The obvious questions are these: Again, who were the Navy controllers who issued the clearances to the fighters? What is their story? Where were they located, and under whose command were they? What is their relationship with the ill-fated Navy Command Center in the southwest face of the Pentagon, and with the "highly secretive" intelligence unit within it?

Until we answer these questions, we can speculate that Navy ATC may have been the link in the communication chain infiltrated by the conspirators. We have to wonder if it was really a Navy controller issuing the absurd clearances, or an imposter. We also have to wonder what the loyal people in the Command Center that day would have told of the day's events, if they had not been killed.

Anyone have any information or comments? Robin?

Navy ATC from inside Pentagon? wwhere did this story go>?
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amazed!
post Oct 26 2007, 09:59 PM
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42 out of 50 were killed.

And the auditors too, so goes the story.

But maybe the term Navy ATC was used wrong? I mean if the place was keeping track of all Navy stuff in the whole world, what good is radar? If they don't have radar, they're not ATC, in the strict sense of the word.
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paranoia
post Dec 6 2007, 06:12 AM
Post #13


dig deeper
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Member No.: 96



the navy connection is much deeper than you might think. recently, while searching for wtc pics, i ran across this:




its from:

1999 held the NAVAL WAR COLLEGE Y2K WORKSHOP:
MONDAY, 4JUN01
Windows on the World, Floor 106, World Trade Center One



http://www.thomaspmbarnett.com/projects/y2k/y2kmayra.htm


bio:

http://www.thomaspmbarnett.com/biography.htm

At the Naval War College, Dr. Barnett served as Director of the NewRuleSets.Project, an ambitious effort to draw new "maps" of power and influence in the world economy so as to expand the U.S. Military's--and specifically, the U.S. Navy's--vision of where and how it can wield maximum influence across the international security environment of the Era of Globalization. The first phase of the project (January 2000-October 2001) was conducted in partnership with the Wall Street broker-dealer firm Cantor Fitzgerald, which hosted three full-day "decision event" workshops atop World Trade Center 1 (Windows on the World). These workshops brought together elite leaders from the worlds of finance, national security, think tanks and industry to discuss the crucial "flows" of globalization, with a special emphasis on Developing Asia. Phase I yielded three briefings and two published reports: one on Asian Energy Futures and another on Foreign Direct Investment. The second phase of the project (November 2001-June 2003) consisted of Dr. Barnett's follow-on work with the Office of Force Transformation. Prior to this study, Dr. Barnett directed the Year 2000 International Security Dimension Project.


another barnett bio:
http://iatgr.org/assets/TomBarnettBio.pdf


more on those "seminars":
http://www.thomaspmbarnett.com/projects/ne...dex.html#phase1
outline/table of contents


http://www.thomaspmbarnett.com/projects/ne...ary%20Brief.htm
many pics of the outline including WTC towers


a who's who thats involved/attends these seminars:
http://www.thomaspmbarnett.com/projects/y2k/appendix_y.htm


if you start checking out the who's who of cantor, u find all kinds of high up navy, deeply embedded there:

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0EI..._14/ai_55153518

Former Navy Admiral Named 'Top Fifty' on Wall Street

William J. "Bud" Flanagan, Senior Managing Director at Cantor Fitzgerald, L.P. and former four star Navy Admiral has been named by Irish America Magazine as one of the 50 most successful Irish Americans on Wall Street. At Cantor Fitzgerald, Adm. Flanagan is involved in developing business structures brought about by government deregulation and privatization. In addition, he is engaged in the development of opportunities in non-financial markets such as energy, natural gas, electricity, oil and other commodities.

Flanagan, 55, joined Cantor Fitzgerald in 1997 after a 29 year career in the United States Navy. From 1994 to 1996, Adm. Flanagan was Commander-in-Chief of the U.S. Atlantic Fleet, with responsibilities for the entire Western Hemisphere and all of Western Europe. He oversaw an $11 billion annual operating budget covering 200,000 personnel, 200 ships and 1350 aircraft around the globe. His innovations prepared the multinational ground, air and naval forces for Operation "Restore Democracy" in Haiti and included directing the rescue of more than 40,000 Cuban and Haitian migrants in the Straits of Florida.



more on flanagan:

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0EI...i_84987452/pg_1

Flanagan, who presently serves as managing partner of Skarven, LLC, a financial services firm, fills the eleventh and final position on Washington Group's board. He joins 10 experienced business executives who were appointed to the board last month, in accordance with the company's Plan of Reorganization.

As Commander-In-Chief of the Atlantic Fleet, Admiral Flanagan oversaw an $11 billion annual operating budget covering 200,000 personnel, 200 ships, and 1,350 aircraft. Prior to joining the Atlantic Fleet, he commanded the United States Second Fleet and NATO's Striking Fleet.

He joined Cantor Fitzgerald in 1997. There, the Admiral was involved directly in the development and design of emerging markets, particularly those brought about by government deregulation and privatization


also:

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0EI..._11/ai_53853131

Former Navy Secretary John H. Dalton and Realty, Financial Leader M. Anthony Fisher Join Cantor Exchange Board

"NEW YORK--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Feb. 10, 1999--The Cantor Exchange (CX), the nation's first full-time electronic exchange for trading U.S. Treasury futures, today announced the appointment of former Secretary of the Navy John H. Dalton and prominent real estate developer and financier M. Anthony Fisher to its Board of Directors. Mr. Dalton and Mr. Fisher join Susan M. Phillips, former member of The Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System and Chairman of the Commodity Futures Trading Commissioner, as public directors of the CX. The CX is jointly operated by Cantor Fitzgerald, L.P. and the New York Board of Trade (NYBOT).

Commenting on the appointments, Howard Lutnick, CEO and President of Cantor Fitzgerald, L.P., said: "The addition of two such distinguished public figures and business leaders to the Cantor Exchange Board represents another strong endorsement of this cutting-edge electronic venue for the efficient trading of Treasury futures and its continuing growth as a major futures marketplace."
Mr. Dalton, who was appointed Secretary of the Navy in July of 1993, served through November 1998. He has served with distinction in both the public and private sectors. No stranger to the financial world, he was with the investment banking firm of Stephens Inc. before joining the Clinton administration. Prior to that, he was with the merchant banking firms of Mason Best Company and Best Associates."


and:

Admiral Arthur K. Cebrowski
http://www.enterrasolutions.com/tom.html

From November 2001 to June of 2003, Dr. Barnett was on temporary assignment as the Assistant for Strategic Futures, Office of Force Transformation (OFT), Office of the Secretary of Defense, where he worked with (then) OFT Director Vice Admiral Arthur K. Cebrowski (USN, ret.) on a cluster of strategic concepts that link change in the international security environment to the imperative of transforming U.S. military capabilities to meet future threats.

Arthur K. Cebrowski, 1942-2005
Navy vice admiral was known as father of network-centric warfare
http://www.fcw.com/print/11_46/news/91498-1.html


Arthur K. Cebrowski and T. Barnett (MUST SEE):

"Operation Iraqi Freedom could be a first step toward a larger goal: true globalization"
http://www.thomaspmbarnett.com/published/gts.htm
http://www.moaa.org/magazine/May2003/f_global.asp


"The American Way of War"
http://www.thomaspmbarnett.com/published/awow.htm
http://www.cdi.org/mrp/tt-13jan03.pdf


***

then i found this (not integral necessarily to the WTC, but its the start of the cf and the navy's relationship - and quite an odd pic):



http://www.hsdl.org/?view&did=456785

http://stinet.dtic.mil/oai/oai?verb=getRec...ifier=ADA430522

Accession Number : ADA430522
Title : The Critical Link: Financial Implications of National Security Threats
Descriptive Note : Exercise rept.
Corporate Author : NAVAL WAR COLL NEWPORT RI
Personal Author(s) : Hayes, Bradd C.

Handle / proxy Url :
http://stinet.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?AD...oc=GetTRDoc.pdf

Report Date : JUN 1998
Pagination or Media Count : 80

Abstract : For most of the past century, the Naval War College has helped the national security community examine potential consequences of a wide range of crisis scenarios. Historically military and diplomatic responses were the focus of these activities. Because the number and types of issues affecting national security continues to grow, however, national security is no longer the special enclave of diplomats and soldiers. It was less than a decade ago that economic issues were first addressed in the President's National Security Strategy, and they were shortly joined by environmental issues as challenges that could adversely affect the nation. In October 1997, the Naval War College, in partnership with Cantor Fitzgerald, conducted the initial Economic Security Exercise exploring the link between maritime security issues and global financial markets. Since economic issues have not been a central focus of most games or decision events conducted at the Naval War College, pursuing a partnership with the financial community was a logical course. Several senior members of Cantor Fitzgerald have close professional ties with the United States Navy, making this a natural partnership. Cantor Fitzgerald provides a broad spectrum of institutional brokerage and execution services to global financial markets. It operates the world's largest electronic marketplace for G-10 sovereign debt, emerging markets and Eurobonds and is one of the largest "third market" equity operations in the US stock market. The success of the first Economic Security Exercise encouraged both institutions to conduct a follow-on event in order to broaden and deepen the discussion. Like the initial Economic Security Exercise, this workshop brought together key figures from the national security, governmental, and financial communities to explore and test the relationships between international events, national security, and financial markets.

Descriptors : *MILITARY STRATEGY, *NATIONAL SECURITY, *FINANCE, GLOBAL, MARKETING, DECISION MAKING, COMMUNITIES, ECONOMICS, THREATS, ARMY PERSONNEL, INTERNATIONAL, CRITICALITY(GENERAL), DIPLOMATS.
Subject Categories : ECONOMICS AND COST ANALYSIS
MILITARY INTELLIGENCE
MILITARY OPERATIONS, STRATEGY AND TACTICS
Distribution Statement : APPROVED FOR PUBLIC RELEASE



***


btw- i have been trying to find a list of navy victims from the pent, but so far this is the only place i found them listed as one group:



tribute plaque to navy victims (names them all):
http://www.news.navy.mil/search/display.asp?story_id=3521
http://www.news.navy.mil/list_single.asp?id=2650


***

nov2011 - edited to add :

http://washingtontechnology.com/articles/2...personally.aspx

QUOTE
Washington Technology - Taking it Personally Employees, firms find meaning in work after terrorist attacks

Just two weeks before Sept. 11, a team of employees from SRA International Inc. handed over control to the Navy of a command center the team had built. Many of the Navy personnel that SRA's employees had worked with and came to know as friends were killed when American Airlines Flight 77 plowed into the Pentagon and destroyed the command center.

“People were understandably distraught,” said Ernst Volgenau, president and chief executive officer of the Fairfax, Va., company.

The same SRA staff returned to the Pentagon and rebuilt the command center. “Like many Americans, they are proud of what they are doing, and resolved to carry on the work that helps keep us safe as a country,” Volgenau said.




http://pentagonmemorial.org/explore/biogra...d-f-deconto-usn
QUOTE
As director of the current operations and plans branch of the Navy Command Center, CAPT Gerald F. DeConto, 44, was organizing the Navy's response to the World Trade Center attack when he died in the crash at the Pentagon.




Pentagon NAVY Command Center deaths:
http://pentagonmemorial.org/search/node/command%20center
https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&saf...272&bih=819


http://web.archive.org/web/20010919102542/...010917/aw48.htm
Pentagon Attack Hits Navy Hard
DAVID A. FULGHUM/WASHINGTON


http://www.nytimes.com/2001/11/17/us/natio...ess-family.html
QUOTE
NAMPA, Idaho, Nov. 14— At the heart of Dorothy Vauk's grief over the last-born of her nine children is a question that has haunted the nation since Sept. 11: How can someone ever manage to hate strangers?

She asks it about the hijackers who plunged a jetliner into the Pentagon where her 37-year-old son, Ron, was the Navy's watch commander. Urgently trying to scramble jet fighters in defense of the capital, Lieutenant Commander Vauk perished in the first moments of what is now the nation's war against terrorism.
.


also see:
http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=8069
http://s10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/ar/t13206.htm

This post has been edited by paranoia: Nov 6 2011, 12:29 AM
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amazed!
post Jun 29 2008, 02:41 PM
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Imagine what it's really like to have worked for 30 years at the Pentagon. Lotta power there, lotsa shenanigans.
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